August 1999

• Game design and gender: An interesting article Nathan F Yospe
• • Game design and gender: An interesting article Jon A. Lambert
  • • Game design and gender: An interesting article Marian Griffith
    • • Game design and gender: An interesting article Jeremy Music "Sterling"
      • • Game design and gender: An interesting article Cynbe ru Taren
        • Game design and gender: An interesting article Caliban Tiresias Darklock
        • • Game design and gender: An interesting article Matthew Mihaly
          • • Game design and gender: An interesting article Caliban Tiresias Darklock
            • • Game design and gender: An interesting article Ben Greear
              • • Game design and gender: An interesting article Albert
          • Game design and gender: An interesting article Koster, Raph
          • Game design and gender: An interesting article Laurel Fan
          • • Game design and gender: An interesting article Caliban Tiresias Darklock
            • • Game design and gender: An interesting article Willowreed@aol.com
              • Game design and gender: An interesting article Albert
        • Game design and gender: An interesting article Koster, Raph
        • • Game design and gender: An interesting article Adam Wiggins
          • Game design and gender: An interesting article Marian Griffith
        • Game design and gender: An interesting article Marian Griffith
      • Game design and gender: An interesting article Ola Fosheim Grøstad
      • • Game design and gender: An interesting article Matthew Mihaly
        • • Game design and gender: An interesting article Adam Wiggins
          • • Game design and gender: An interesting article Caliban Tiresias Darklock
            • Game design and gender: An interesting article Matthew Mihaly
        • Game design and gender: An interesting article Marian Griffith
        • • Game design and gender: An interesting article Mik Clarke
        • Game design and gender: An interesting article Marian Griffith
        • • Game design and gender: An interesting article Ola Fosheim Grøstad
  • Game design and gender: An interesting article Greg Miller
• question about tile-based games Chris Gray
• • question about tile-based games Scott Boding
  • question about tile-based games Jeremy Music "Sterling"
  • • question about tile-based games Katrina McClelan
    • • question about tile-based games Caliban Tiresias Darklock
      • • question about tile-based games Hans-Henrik Staerfeldt
        • • question about tile-based games Chris Gray
    • question about tile-based games AR Schleicher
  • question about tile-based games Wes Connell
  • question about tile-based games AR Schleicher
  • • question about tile-based games Wes Connell
• Mud Census? Timothy O'Neill Dang
• MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Par Winzell
• • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Dr. Cat
  • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Matthew Mihaly
• MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Par Winzell
• • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Matthew Mihaly
• MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Wes Connell
• • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Koster, Raph
  • • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Greg Miller
    • • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Colin Coghill
      • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Marian Griffith
      • • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Greg Miller
        • • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Matthew Mihaly
          • • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Miroslav Silovic
            • • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Matthew Mihaly
              • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Caliban Tiresias Darklock
          • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Marian Griffith
          • • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Greg Miller
            • • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Marian Griffith
              • • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Greg Miller
        • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Koster, Raph
        • • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Mik Clarke
          • • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Koster, Raph
            • • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Mik Clarke
              • • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Koster, Raph
                • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Greg Miller
          • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Wes Connell
          • • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Albert
          • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Marian Griffith
          • • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Ilya, SCC, Game Commando
            • • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Matthew Mihaly
              • • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Marian Griffith
                • • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Greg Miller
                  • • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Marian Griffith
              • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Caliban Tiresias Darklock
              • • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Ilya, SCC, Game Commando
                • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Matthew Mihaly
                • • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Caliban Tiresias Darklock
                  • • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Matthew Mihaly
                    • • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Koster, Raph
                • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Greg Miller
  • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Ola Fosheim Grøstad
  • • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Koster, Raph
    • • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Ola Fosheim Grøstad
      • • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Koster, Raph
        • • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Ola Fosheim Grøstad
    • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Greg Miller
  • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Marian Griffith
  • • MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Matthew Mihaly
• Designing fun sims. (was MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs) Ola Fosheim Grøstad
• The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Dundee
• • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Ola Fosheim Grøstad
  • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Ilya, SCC, Game Commando
    • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Colin Coghill
      • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Ilya, SCC, Game Commando
        • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Sellers, Michael
        • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Wes Connell
        • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Matthew Mihaly
          • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Koster, Raph
            • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Wes Connell
          • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Sellers, Michael
      • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Ola Fosheim Grøstad
      • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Ilya, SCC, Game Commando
        • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Dundee
          • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Ilya, Game Commandos
            • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Dundee
              • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Jon A. Lambert
                • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Travis S. Casey
                • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing J C Lawrence
                • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Koster, Raph
                  • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Adam Wiggins
                  • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Koster, Raph
                    • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Adam Wiggins
                      • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Koster, Raph
                        • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Ola Fosheim Grøstad
                        • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Wes Connell
                        • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Travis S. Casey
                          • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Wes Connell
                            • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Travis S. Casey
                              • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Caliban Tiresias Darklock
                                • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Dundee
                                  • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Travis Casey
                                  • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Caliban Tiresias Darklock
                          • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Dundee
                        • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing J C Lawrence
                        • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Robin Cloutman
                        • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Adam Wiggins
                          • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Ilya, Game Commandos
                            • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Wes Connell
                          • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Laurel Fan
                          • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Mik Clarke
                      • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing J C Lawrence
                      • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing J C Lawrence
                    • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing J C Lawrence
                  • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Timothy O'Neill Dang
                  • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing J C Lawrence
                  • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Dundee
                  • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing J C Lawrence
                    • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Caliban Tiresias Darklock
                    • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Dundee
                      • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Adam Wiggins
                        • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Greg Miller
                        • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Ilya, Game Commandos
                  • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Travis S. Casey
              • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Chris Turner
              • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Adam Wiggins
                • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Chris Turner
          • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Ola Fosheim Grøstad
          • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Ilya, Game Commandos
            • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Ola Fosheim Grøstad
            • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Greg Miller
            • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Ola Fosheim Grøstad
              • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Caliban Tiresias Darklock
                • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Greg Miller
  • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Eli Stevens {KiZurich}
  • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Adam Wiggins
    • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing J C Lawrence
      On Wed, 15 Sep 1999 01:49:52 -0500
      KiZurich <Eli> wrote:
      
      > I do not think that spare time alone should decide the "elite" of
      > a mud. However, I think it would be more productive to limit the
      > effectiveness of the *playstyles* of powergamers, not to penalize
      > players being online. Just MHO.
      
      I'd classify a finer distinction:
      
      What defines the most capable players in the game?
      
      Is it those players with the "best" stats? (Prior advantage
      taken of the game world)
      
      Is it those players with the greatest (personal) knowledge of
      the game/world? (prior OOC knowledge gained)
      
      Is it those players with the largest set of social ties to other
      players (currently playing, or perhaps just in total)? (prior
      social activities)
      
      Or, is it some combination of the above, and if so, in what
      ratios?
      
      Thinking about this briefly (its late and I'm tired) suggests that
      this parallels the player suits in a rather interesting manner. Its
      not really clubs, diamonds, hearts, and spades, but it also is
      
      > Ex: A player "hides" once in a room, moves and hides again
      > quickly. Hide has a frequency of one minute. The second hide is
      > not considered for improvement. Two minutes after the first hide,
      > the player hides again, four times fairly quickly. Only the first
      > of the four is considered for improvement, and it will be at least
      > four more minutes before the player has a chance to improve it
      > more.
      
      I've been toying with the idea of attempting to detect character
      stress and varying the skill improvement delta dependent on what the
      level of character stress is, and how significant the outcome of the
      skill application is. There's a really softie area in here, but as
      with the prior discussions, it seems that with just some basic
      history keeping you can actually get a pretty decent idea of player
      intent and from there derive a concept of risk and thus significance
      and stress.
      
      Thus, Bubba hiding in the swamp while nobody is about does him
      almost nothing. Conversely, Bubba being chased by Tiamat and then
      succssfully eluding Tiamat (high risk) by hiding in the swamp
      (highyl significant outcome) would gain significantly more.
      
      One problem with this approach, tho it could be a benefit, is that
      the concept of "practicing" goes away. The only way to learn a
      skill in this world is to go out and use it in real circumstances
      where to some extent you put yourself on the line in doing so.
      
      How basketweaving basketweaving or fishing (indirectly
      survival-related skills) fits in here I'm not quite sure. Perhaps
      another pattern for those?
      
      > Spamming a skill (or bot-like repetitive behavior) will have an
      > effect opposite the desired. If someone hides 60 times in a row,
      > it will be at least an hour before they could hope to improve it
      > again.
      
      This does not prevent the skill training from being scripted. All
      that is required is that the training script keep a tally of the
      time since the last exercise of the skill and then runs it when
      optimal. In the "hide" case, you'd just find your character
      seemingly randomly trying to HIDE every few minutes as the script
      notices that the clock has wound down enough again.
      
      Get enough of these scripts running of course and you could have a
      character that just sits there, frantically excercising all his
      skills in a carefully timed sequence as each one's clock winds out.
      
      > The system would favor players who use a skill, then let it sit,
      > and use it again later.
      
      Or who have a script that runs in the background that knows to try
      and "XXX" every 90 seconds, and does it automagically.
      
      > Of course, if players are told the details of the system, it could
      > still be abused, but only once a minute. :)
      
      Quite. Given the reverse engineering efforts I've done and seen
      done on various systems (the most recent example being the full stat
      progression charts empirically derived from UOL players), I'd take
      it as a given that all players would know your mechanics.
      
      That's the problem with mechanical systems. They're mechanical. As
      such they are inherently predictable and manipulable in determined
      manners as machines. Even if you add random factors the graphs in
      almost all cases can still be approximated in a sufficiently useful
      fashion by quite a simple curve.
      
      Heck, I don't care how many factors you have, almost any curve can
      be approximated to a fairly useful degree by a couple straight
      lines, a simple quadratic, a simple wave, or an asymptote. There's
      no magic there. Jsut get enough data points and sketch something
      roughly out and can have quite a significant player advantage.
      
      > ... But I have no idea how it might work out with real players.
      > Ones who have the spare time to figure out how to exploit the
      > system... :)
      
      That's the interesting bit: How to derive a systems which implements
      non-deterministic feedback responses to each character
      individually/dynamically without becoming so random as to lose all
      sense of predictability and thus lose all sense of the possibility
      of attaining a/the goal.
      
      <ponder>
      
      --
      J C Lawrence Life: http://www.kanga.nu/ Home: claw@kanga.nu
      ---------(*) Work (Linux/IA64): claw@varesearch.com
      ... Beware of cromagnons wearing chewing gum and palm pilots ...
    • • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Wes Connell
      • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Greg Miller
  • The Best Guy on the Mud Thing Dundee
• Balancing issues (renamed) Marian Griffith
• Singleton design pattern (OT?) Eli Stevens {KiZurich}
• • Singleton design pattern (OT?) Wayne Pearson
  • Singleton design pattern (OT?) Cynbe ru Taren
  • • Singleton design pattern (OT?) Adam Wiggins
• OT: My absence J C Lawrence
• ScryMUD: News update (Opening to the Public on the 4th of September!) Ben Greear