March 2003
- MMORPG/MMOG P2P design Steven J. Owens
- Dinner, Conference and BBQ J C Lawrence
- Dinner, Conference and BBQ J C Lawrence
- Wow, Jessica's working on Ac2? Chris
- Small Worlds, GDC talk Koster, Raph
- Small Worlds, GDC talk Peter Tyson
- Better Game Design through Data Mining, MDC talk David Kennerly
- MUD-Dev conference and dinner report J C Lawrence
- MUD-Dev conference and dinner report J C Lawrence
- MUD-Dev conference and dinner report Smith, David {Lynchburg}
- Fighting Lag Elia Morling
- Fighting Lag Nicolai Hansen
- Fighting Lag Daniel.Harman@barclayscapital.com
- Fighting Lag Ian Macintosh
- Fighting Lag Daniel.Harman@barclayscapital.com
- Fighting Lag Travis Nixon
- Fighting Lag Nicolai Hansen
- Fighting Lag Vladimir Vukicevic
- Fighting Lag Jo Dillon
- Fighting Lag Mike Shaver
- Fighting Lag Bruce Mitchener
- Fighting Lag Brian Hook
- Fighting Lag Paul Schwanz
- Fighting Lag Elia Morling
- Fighting Lag Ian Macintosh
- Fighting Lag ceo
- Fighting Lag arch stanton
- Fighting Lag Tom Hubina
- Fighting Lag Steven J. Owens
- Fighting Lag Amanda Walker
- A Founding Father Forgotten Scott Miller
- A Founding Father Forgotten Travis Casey
- A Founding Father Forgotten Richard Aihoshi aka Jonric
- A Founding Father Forgotten Travis Casey
- A Founding Father Forgotten Adam Dray
- A Founding Father Forgotten Travis Casey
- A Founding Father Forgotten Adam Dray
- A Founding Father Forgotten Michael Tresca
- A Founding Father Forgotten Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- A Founding Father Forgotten John Robert Arras
- A Founding Father Forgotten Michael Tresca
- A Founding Father Forgotten Matt Mihaly
- A Founding Father Forgotten Michael Chui
- A Founding Father Forgotten Matt Mihaly
- A Founding Father Forgotten Michael Tresca
- A Founding Father Forgotten Sean Kelly
- A Founding Father Forgotten Michael Tresca
- A Founding Father Forgotten Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- A Founding Father Forgotten Michael Tresca
- A Founding Father Forgotten Paul Schwanz
- A Founding Father Forgotten John Robert Arras
- A Founding Father Forgotten Thomas Tomiczek
- A Founding Father Forgotten Paul Schwanz
- A Founding Father Forgotten Ryan Arthur
- A Founding Father Forgotten Threshold RPG
- A Founding Father Forgotten David Kennerly
- A Founding Father Forgotten eck@wizards.com
- A Founding Father Forgotten Ben Hoyt
- A Founding Father Forgotten Paul Schwanz
- A Founding Father Forgotten Bad Mojo
- A Founding Father Forgotten Matt Mihaly
- MDC and talk John Robert Arras
- More on Small Worlds Koster, Raph
- More on Small Worlds Ted L. Chen
- More on Small Worlds Lee Sheldon
- More on Small Worlds Jeff Cole
- More on Small Worlds Boyle, Paul
- More on Small Worlds - Simulation of behviours in populations ceo
- BIZ: MMP subscriber numbers Daniel James
- BIZ: MMP subscriber numbers Diamonds
- BIZ: MMP subscriber numbers Chris Holko
- BIZ: MMP subscriber numbers szii@sziisoft.com
- BIZ: MMP subscriber numbers Rudy Fink
- BIZ: MMP subscriber numbers Threshold RPG
- BIZ: MMP subscriber numbers Damion Schubert
- BIZ: MMP subscriber numbers Chris
- BIZ: MMP subscriber numbers Lee Sheldon
- BIZ: MMP subscriber numbers Baar - Lord of the Seven Suns
- BIZ: MMP subscriber numbers Christopher Allen
- BIZ: MMP subscriber numbers Scott Jennings
- BIZ: MMP subscriber numbers Threshold RPG
- BIZ: MMP subscriber numbers Lee Sheldon
- Massively Multiplayer Game Development (Game Developmen t Series) Daniel.Harman@barclayscapital.com
- Massively Multiplayer Game Development (Game Developmen t Series) Jeremy Noetzelman
- Massively Multiplayer Game Development (Game Develo pment Series) Koster, Raph
- Massively Multiplayer Game Development (Game Development Series) Jessica Mulligan
- Massively Multiplayer Game Development (Game Development Series) Damion Schubert
- Massively Multiplayer Game Development (Game Developmen t Series) Ted Milker
- Winnable MMO apollyon
- Winnable MMO Edward Glowacki
- Winnable MMO Vincent Archer
- Winnable MMO kat-Zygfryd
- Winnable MMO Miroslav Silovic
- Winnable MMO eric
- Winnable MMO John Robert Arras
- Winnable MMO Diamonds
- Winnable MMO Threshold RPG
- Winnable MMO Vincent Archer
- Winnable MMO Diamonds
- Winnable MMO Chris Nielsen
Hmm... first contribution to the list, so be gentle... :)
<EdNote: Please place new text below the quote it refers to and trim
the quote as per http://www.kanga.nu/lists/listinfo/mud-dev/. I've
fixed this message -- claw>
Threshold RPG wrote:
> Again, I point to sports games, chess, and games like them. There
> is always a loser. If you are bad and play against people who are
> much better, you will always lose.
This is a bit of a misnomer, in that no one (except for that
one-in-a-million masochist) will play a game they always lose at. You lose
and take it cause you know you're getting better and will hopefully win one
day. If you pass that point where the return on investment hasn't come and
the investment isn't worth paying out anymore (no fun, why waste my time?)
then you're not going to play anymore.
Ironically, I reached a point similar to this in EverQuest, which I believe
was categorized in this discussion as a no-win type of game. I got tired of
not gaining recognizable advances with my character only being able to (only
wanting to) spend "casual gamer" hours playing. I felt I wasn't "winning"
and the frustration of this outweighed the fun I got from the actual play
and the interaction that makes up so much of that game. There is a
crowd-influenced focus in that game that sours this kind of categorization,
however. I so much wanted to make the most of each stage I got to, exploring
all the content available for each level range. But no one else did, most
notably my close friends whom I played with. If you're not in the high game
you're not in the game at all. In essence this ruins (at least, severely
diminishes) what EverQuest really has to offer. That game is three times as
big as the players make it. Maybe even more.
This is the danger in trying to shift the focus away from "winning". I think
people *want* to play games where they can win, even if most of the time
they lose. It's because when you do win it makes all the losses worth it.
Very much so.
If EverQuest had been designed with clearly defined "wins" along the level
treadmill do you think people would have made the most of the content if
exploring that content was necessary to winning each of those objectives? I
certainly do. Many wouldn't, but certainly a lot more would.
-Chris Nielsen - Winnable MMO Sara Jensen
- Winnable MMO Chris Holko
- Winnable MMO Chris Mancil
- Winnable MMO szii@sziisoft.com
- Winnable MMO Mike Shaver
- Winnable MMO Threshold RPG
- Winnable MMO shren
- Winnable MMO Threshold RPG
- Winnable MMO Matt Mihaly
- Winnable MMO Talies the Wanderer
- Winnable MMO Steven J. Owens
- Winnable MMO John Buehler
- Winnable MMO Larry Dunlap
- Winnable MMO Jonathon Duerig
- Winnable MMO ceo