March 2003
- MMORPG/MMOG P2P design Steven J. Owens
- Dinner, Conference and BBQ J C Lawrence
- Dinner, Conference and BBQ J C Lawrence
- Wow, Jessica's working on Ac2? Chris
- Small Worlds, GDC talk Koster, Raph
- Small Worlds, GDC talk Peter Tyson
- Better Game Design through Data Mining, MDC talk David Kennerly
- MUD-Dev conference and dinner report J C Lawrence
- MUD-Dev conference and dinner report J C Lawrence
- MUD-Dev conference and dinner report Smith, David {Lynchburg}
- Fighting Lag Elia Morling
- Fighting Lag Nicolai Hansen
- Fighting Lag Daniel.Harman@barclayscapital.com
- Fighting Lag Ian Macintosh
- Fighting Lag Daniel.Harman@barclayscapital.com
- Fighting Lag Travis Nixon
- Fighting Lag Nicolai Hansen
- Fighting Lag Vladimir Vukicevic
- Fighting Lag Jo Dillon
- Fighting Lag Mike Shaver
- Fighting Lag Bruce Mitchener
- Fighting Lag Brian Hook
- Fighting Lag Paul Schwanz
- Fighting Lag Elia Morling
- Fighting Lag Ian Macintosh
- Fighting Lag ceo
- Fighting Lag arch stanton
- Fighting Lag Tom Hubina
- Fighting Lag Steven J. Owens
On Wed, Mar 12, 2003 at 10:56:44AM +0100, Elia Morling wrote:
> I'm currently working on a spartime project, Tildruin - a free
> online rpg. The game is hybrid between text-based and graphical
> interface, as the player can select his/her style of play. It is
> possible to turn off graphics altogether and play MUD-style, but I
> imagine most players will adopt a mixed style of point-and-click
> and text commands.
Interesting. I've thought of trying something like this, mainly
because I think the classic (non LP and LP-derived, like diku) MUD
world is still light years ahead of the MMOG world, in terms of
actual game _design_. But the public wants a clicky interface...
> In a perfect world all relayed messages would stick to the
> estimated fps for excellent perceived performance. It is not the
> general "lag" that proposes the largest challenge, it is an
> inconsistent "lag" which is the problem. The problems cloud when
> messages arrive too early and too late, causing jagged/unreliable
> animation. Up to this point we have tried:
> 1. Dropping frames (causing jumps of character location)
> 2. Catching up frames (causing speedy-gonzales effects)
I'm sure there are more knowledgable 3D programmers here, but maybe
I can get the ball rolling. From various reading I've done, the
model most people use seems to be largely building more smarts into
the client side.
1) Send updates to the client, not frames. Let the client
build the frames.
2) Make sure updates contain atomic information, so you don't
have to worry about out-of-sequence or just plain dropped
packets.
3) have the client *predict* what's going on and render based
on those predictions; when updates arrive, correct the model
and re-render (this is the source of the classic quake
experience where you're pounding away at somebody who doesn't
seem to notice you, then all of a sudden you're dead! It
sucks, but it seems to be the best we can do with current
technology)
You can make the client predictions smarter by applying more
skullwork and coding. I remember one article I came across that
talked about using a mathematical technique to model not only a
given object's vector, but the change in vector over time as well.
With that approach, the prediction would be more likely to be
accurate.
> I'm currently working on a solution where the client adopts its
> estimation of the servers current frame periodically based on
> current lag/round-trip. This will cause the client to "rewind"
> and "fastforward" time to make up for the current lag, as the
> quality of the players connection is far from constant during an
> entire session and we need it to be as consitent as possible.
I'd definitely recommend building some sort of lag metering into the
protocol, though I don't know how much overhead that would add.
> I'm asking for general input and wise suggestions. There must be
> huge experience in this area. How have others solved this problem?
> Are there any articles or books on the topic?
There're a buncha books out there; I did some looking, last year,
but didn't find much particular to networked game programming. In
more general game programming, the Game Programming Gems seem to be
highly respected as a source of in-depth articles on various topics.
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1584500492/qid47712213/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/103-5217580-0895062?v=glance&s=books
Steven J. Owens
puff@darksleep.com
"I'm going to make broad, sweeping generalizations and strong,
declarative statements, because otherwise I'll be here all night and
this document will be four times longer and much less fun to read.
Take it all with a grain of salt." - Me at http://darksleep.com - Fighting Lag Amanda Walker
- A Founding Father Forgotten Scott Miller
- A Founding Father Forgotten Travis Casey
- A Founding Father Forgotten Richard Aihoshi aka Jonric
- A Founding Father Forgotten Travis Casey
- A Founding Father Forgotten Adam Dray
- A Founding Father Forgotten Travis Casey
- A Founding Father Forgotten Adam Dray
- A Founding Father Forgotten Michael Tresca
- A Founding Father Forgotten Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- A Founding Father Forgotten John Robert Arras
- A Founding Father Forgotten Michael Tresca
- A Founding Father Forgotten Matt Mihaly
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- A Founding Father Forgotten Matt Mihaly
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- A Founding Father Forgotten Sean Kelly
- A Founding Father Forgotten Michael Tresca
- A Founding Father Forgotten Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- A Founding Father Forgotten Michael Tresca
- A Founding Father Forgotten Paul Schwanz
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- A Founding Father Forgotten Thomas Tomiczek
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- A Founding Father Forgotten Ben Hoyt
- A Founding Father Forgotten Paul Schwanz
- A Founding Father Forgotten Bad Mojo
- A Founding Father Forgotten Matt Mihaly
- MDC and talk John Robert Arras
- More on Small Worlds Koster, Raph
- More on Small Worlds Ted L. Chen
- More on Small Worlds Lee Sheldon
- More on Small Worlds Jeff Cole
- More on Small Worlds Boyle, Paul
- More on Small Worlds - Simulation of behviours in populations ceo
- BIZ: MMP subscriber numbers Daniel James
- BIZ: MMP subscriber numbers Diamonds
- BIZ: MMP subscriber numbers Chris Holko
- BIZ: MMP subscriber numbers szii@sziisoft.com
- BIZ: MMP subscriber numbers Rudy Fink
- BIZ: MMP subscriber numbers Threshold RPG
- BIZ: MMP subscriber numbers Damion Schubert
- BIZ: MMP subscriber numbers Chris
- BIZ: MMP subscriber numbers Lee Sheldon
- BIZ: MMP subscriber numbers Baar - Lord of the Seven Suns
- BIZ: MMP subscriber numbers Christopher Allen
- BIZ: MMP subscriber numbers Scott Jennings
- BIZ: MMP subscriber numbers Threshold RPG
- BIZ: MMP subscriber numbers Lee Sheldon
- Massively Multiplayer Game Development (Game Developmen t Series) Daniel.Harman@barclayscapital.com
- Massively Multiplayer Game Development (Game Developmen t Series) Jeremy Noetzelman
- Massively Multiplayer Game Development (Game Develo pment Series) Koster, Raph
- Massively Multiplayer Game Development (Game Development Series) Jessica Mulligan
- Massively Multiplayer Game Development (Game Development Series) Damion Schubert
- Massively Multiplayer Game Development (Game Developmen t Series) Ted Milker
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