February 2002
- Article: Moral Outrage - Bizarre as it seems, indignation makes the world go round (from New Scientist) Christopher Allen
- premium servers Matt Mihaly
- premium servers Talies the Wanderer
- premium servers Matt Mihaly
- premium servers Christopher Allen
- premium servers Christopher Allen
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Marian Griffith
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) rayzam
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) John Buehler
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Matt Mihaly
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Matt Mihaly
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Matt Mihaly
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Marian Griffith
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) John Buehler
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Matt Mihaly
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Sasha Hart
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Freeman, Jeff
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Matt Mihaly
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Matt Mihaly
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Madrona Tree
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Talies the Wanderer
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Marc Hernandez
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Sasha Hart
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Sasha Hart
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Rogue_Buddha
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Matt Mihaly
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Christopher Allen
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Sasha Hart
- Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls) Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- NEWS: Release of v0.21 of Murpg Core Mike Povoski
- story vs. screenplay Nicholas E. Walker
- story vs. screenplay Koster, Raph
- story vs. screenplay Sean K
- story vs. screenplay ghovs
- story vs. screenplay Nicholas E. Walker
- story vs. screenplay ghovs
- story vs. screenplay James Edward Gray II
- story vs. screenplay ghovs
- story vs. screenplay Marian Griffith
- story vs. screenplay Nicholas E. Walker
- story vs. screenplay Marian Griffith
- MUD Protocols? Neil Edwards
- MUD Protocols? Matt Owen
- MUD Protocols? Bruce Mitchener
- MUD Protocols? Andrew Wilson
- MUD Protocols? Phillip Lenhardt
- MUD Protocols? Lars Duening
- MUD Protocols? Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- MUD Protocols? Jon Leonard
- MUD Protocols? Chris Gray
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights Koster, Raph
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights Geoffrey MacDougall
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights Matt Mihaly
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights Rudy Fink
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights Dave Shepherd
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights Steve {Bloo} Daniels
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights Derek Licciardi
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights Dave Rickey
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights Richard A. Bartle
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights Blane Bramble
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights Sellers, Mike
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights kuvasza
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights Matt Mihaly
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights Frank Crowell
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights Freeman, Jeff
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights Frank Crowell
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights Dave Rickey
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights Dr. Cat
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights Alex Kay
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights Jeff Cole
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights John Buehler
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights Jeff Cole
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights John Buehler
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights Dr. Cat
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights Matt Mihaly
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights Hans-Henrik Staerfeldt
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights Vincent Archer
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights John Buehler
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights Steve {Bloo} Daniels
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights Hans-Henrik Staerfeldt
- BlackSnow sues Mythic for online property rights Marc Bowden
- [BIZ] Players - GMs ratio Mathieu Castelli
- [BIZ] Players - GMs ratio Robert A. Rice Jr.
- [BIZ] Players - GMs ratio Mathieu Castelli
- Ethical behavior ... a hijacking. Jeff Cole
- Ethical behavior ... a hijacking. Matt Mihaly
- Ethical behavior ... a hijacking. Koster, Raph
- Ethical behavior ... a hijacking. Matt Mihaly
- Ethical behavior ... a hijacking. Jeff Cole
- Ethical behavior ... a hijacking. John Buehler
- Ethical behavior ... a hijacking. Marc Bowden
- Ethical behavior ... a hijacking. Travis Casey
- Ethical behavior ... a hijacking. Matt Mihaly
- Ethical behavior ... a hijacking. John Buehler
- Ethical behavior ... a hijacking. Jon Lambert
- "Advanced" use of virtual worlds? (MMORPGs & MUDs) Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- "Advanced" use of virtual worlds? (MMORPGs & MUDs) J C Lawrence
- "Advanced" use of virtual worlds? (MMORPGs & MUDs) Matt Mihaly
- "Advanced" use of virtual worlds? (MMORPGs & MUDs) Travis Casey
- "Advanced" use of virtual worlds? (MMORPGs & MUDs) Michael Tresca
- Merc++ the_sage2000@juno.com
- ADMIN: Bullets. conservation of momentum etc J C Lawrence
- EULA Structure Eli Stevens
- EULA Structure Hans-Henrik Staerfeldt
- EULA Structure Matt Mihaly
- EULA Structure Frank Crowell
- EULA Structure Bruce Mitchener
- EULA Structure Hans-Henrik Staerfeldt
- EULA Structure Steve {Bloo} Daniels
- Thank you from MudWorld ucmm@inetsolve.com
- Thank you from MudWorld Matt Mihaly
- Thank you from MudWorld Matt Owen
- Thank you from MudWorld Chris Lloyd
- Re[4]: "Advanced" use of virtual worlds? (MMORPGs & MUDs) Travis Casey
- What's Important in a Driver? Jonathan Ross
- Everquest player survey with interesting points Olof Ekström
- Myth II Game server has gone open source Frank Crowell
- Question about threads. Anderson, David
- Question about threads. J C Lawrence
- Question about threads. Nathan F. Yospe
- Question about threads. Sean K
- Question about threads. Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- Question about threads. Daniel.Harman@barclayscapital.com
- TECH : MUD game on a multi agent system Cyril MudDev
- TECH : MUD game on a multi agent system Marc Bowden
- TECH : MUD game on a multi agent system John Robert Arras
- TECH : MUD game on a multi agent system Robert Zubek
- Using the survey Info to make real factual argument WAS: Everquest player survey with interesting points Sasha Hart
[Olof]
> Many of the things covered in the survey tie in closely to threads
> currently or recently active on this list.
I found this particularly interesting in light of the girls/boys
discussion that's been in here lately...
Particularly, persistent complaints that facts are irrelevant or too
hard to get, therefore failures to say anything with content should
be thrown out as unreasonable or something...
[EQ player survey]
> Playing EQ with a romantic partner
> 25% (N94) of EQ players play the game with a romantic
> partner. There is a significant gender difference. 69.5% of female
> players play the game with a romantic partner, while only 16.4% of
> male players do (p<.001).
Assuming that this is a meaningful result, it is gigantic. 69.5%!!
How to interpret this?
The author of the study says:
> We could ask, for example, how gender is projected into
> EverQuest. What differences in role-playing preferences or in-game
> behaviors can we find between male and female players? Does
> EverQuest appeal to male and female players in the same way? Do
> they continue to play for the same reasons? Or do they get
> different things out of playing the game?
Pretty similar things are getting said in our thread.
I ask questions, so I can try answering it using *real info*:
(*WOW*!!)
--- Do women particularly enjoy playing with romantic partners?
--- Possibly, is EQ repellent to women, (e.g. a guy game), but
played as a way of interacting/being with their S.O.s?
Looking at the evidence this site provides: [From a figure]: 25.8%
have responded yes to "I have had a crush on or fallen in love with
another EQ player."
Some women are probably hooking up in EQ.
> 14.5% (N&9) of female players and 3.3% (N06) of male players
> are in real-life romantic relationships that started in EQ.
This confirms it; note however the discrepancy between ~70% who play
with romantic partners, and 14.5% who met current partners on
EQ. There's no way to tell how many people met partners on EQ but do
not play with them, probably not many but some. Also there are
probably some who did not meet their current partners in EQ per se,
but who play EQ independently of relationships (e.g. if two EQ
addicts hooked up at school.)
So at the most , let's say about 50% of women are playing with
people they met outside of EQ. That's a ton, but mind, it's only
half still, and it's a generous estimate.
Oh, look:
> Of those EQ players who game with a romantic partner, about
> one-third (33.8%, N0) purchased the game specifically as
> something they could do together.
> Of those EQ players who game with a romantic partner, about a
> third (35%, N0) say they almost always are grouped with their
> partner. Another 20% say that they are often grouped.
The first number is awfully close to the number who purchased the
game as something to do together. This is across genders, though,
and I assume two copies have to be purchased for a couple to play;
so we don't really know who is buying what.
Although there is some difficulty interpreting the data, I'm much
farther along than if I'd just assumed that my initial idea was the
case and argued it heatedly.
Now I can see that it is almost certainly the case with some
substantial part of the population, but definitely not even a
majority. Significance doesn't really tell us about how universal
the generalization is; when I say (with justification) that a lot of
women play EQ to be with their S.Os, I am only half right in the
sense that probably at least 50% of women are NOT doing so, even if
a number ARE.
And I am by most indications wrong if I say that women are less
invested in the game. They are playing just as much; why assume they
like it less? Seems to me that EQ is a girl game as much as it is a
boy game, that is, to the girls who are in there...
> About a quarter (23.7%, N$74) of EQ players have at least one
> character above level 50. .. There are no significant gender
> differences.
> Female players get significantly more satisfaction than male
> players from killing mobs (T[1496]=-2.17, Mmale(1256)=2.77,
> Mfemale(242)=2.89, p=.03), from completing a quest (T[1495]=-3.80,
> Mmale(1255)=3.43, Mfemale(242)=3.61, p<.001), from crafting a
> complex trade skill item (T[1487]=-3.90, Mmale(1248)=3.1,
> Mfemale(241)=3.35, p<.001), and from making friends in EQ
> (T[1492]=-5.60, Mmale(1253)=3.3, Mfemale(241)=3.59, p<.001).
> Female players are significantly more likely than male players to
> have upgraded their internet connection for EQ (%male(2074)).9,
> %female(367)8.4, p=.001) Female players are significantly more
> likely to have upgraded their computers for EQ when compared with
> male players (%male(2068)D.9%, %female(368)d.7, p<.001).
> About one-third (36.0%, N97) of players who are in guilds are
> in an officer or leader position. Female players are significantly
> more likely to be in officer or leader positions than male players
> are (%male(1146)3.9, %female(230)E.2, p<.001).
My initial idea was probably wrong. Not only have I answered my
question to my satisfaction, but I know other things about EQ at any
rate: that playing with an S.O. is done and important to many women,
but does not mean that women who do play are any less interested or
invested in the game.
If an opinion about a factual matter is one for which no information
is available, maybe the time is not yet ripe for everyone to believe
it without qualification. Unless the *goal* is a pissing contest. :) - [BIZ] Selling Sex, Power, and Prestige Dave Kennerly
- [BIZ] Selling Sex, Power, and Prestige Sasha Hart
- Mob (NPC) behavior William Murdick
- Mob (NPC) behavior Freeman, Jeff
- Mob (NPC) behavior Valerio Santinelli
- Mob (NPC) behavior Sean K
- Mob (NPC) behavior Sasha Hart
- Mob (NPC) behavior J C Lawrence
- Mob (NPC) behavior Kevin Reid
- Mob (NPC) behavior Mike Povoski
- Mob (NPC) behavior Sasha Hart
- [TECH] Event Queue System the_sage2000@juno.com
- [TECH] Event Queue System Lars Duening
- [TECH] Event Queue System J C Lawrence
- [TECH] Event Queue System Phillip Lenhardt
- [TECH] Event Queue System Lars Duening
- [TECH] Event Queue System Blane Bramble
- [TECH] Event Queue System John Robert Arras
- [TECH] Event Queue System Kwon Ekstrom
- [TECH] Event Queue System Jon Leonard
- Immersion lawsuit Frank Crowell
- Spouse play (was Using the survey Info to make real Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- Spouse play (was Using the survey Info to make real Lars Duening
- RP definitions J C Lawrence
- roleplaying Matt Mihaly
- Girl's Perspective (was: Boys and Girls) Katy Morris
- Girl's Perspective (was: Boys and Girls) Paul Schwanz
- Girl's Perspective (was: Boys and Girls) Katy Anderson {Morris}
- Girl's Perspective (was: Boys and Girls) Amanda Walker
- Spouse play Sasha Hart
- Student Interview Steve Wilson
- Statistics (was: Girl appeal (was: Boys and Girls)) Sasha Hart
- "Advanced" use of virtual worlds? (MMORPGs & MUDs) Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- I 0Wn Y0o, d00d (Latest 'Biting The Hand' column at Skotos) Christopher Allen
- Online Worlds Timeline Update Koster, Raph
- Online Worlds Timeline Update Richard A. Bartle
- Online Worlds Timeline Update Christopher Allen
- Online Worlds Timeline Update Travis Casey
- Online Worlds Timeline Update Jeff Freeman
- DCMA -- another weapon in the fight against Emulators Frank Crowell
- DCMA -- another weapon in the fight against Emulators Eric Rhea
- DCMA -- another weapon in the fight against Emulators Frank Crowell
- DCMA -- another weapon in the fight against Emulators Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- DCMA -- another weapon in the fight against Emulators bruce@cubik.org
- DCMA -- another weapon in the fight against Emulators Frank Crowell
- DCMA -- another weapon in the fight against Emulators Frank Crowell
- DCMA -- another weapon in the fight against Emulators Frank Crowell
- DCMA -- another weapon in the fight against Emulators Jon Lambert
- DCMA -- another weapon in the fight against Emulators Travis Nixon
- DCMA -- another weapon in the fight against Emulators Frank Crowell
- [TECH] Peer-to-peer downloads for MMO games Olof Ekstrom
- [TECH] Peer-to-peer downloads for MMO games Daniel.Harman@barclayscapital.com
- [TECH] Peer-to-peer downloads for MMO games Oliver Jowett
- [TECH] Peer-to-peer downloads for MMO games Jon Leonard
- character longevity statistics Val Trullinger
- MajorMUD recollections. Online Worlds Timeline Update Patrick Mahle
- MajorMUD and other BBS MUDs (was: Online Worlds Timeline Update) Scott Jennings
- DaoC postmortem at Gamasutra Azeraab
- DaoC postmortem at Gamasutra Buddy Grizzard
- DaoC postmortem at Gamasutra Dave Rickey
- DaoC postmortem at Gamasutra Marc Bowden
- DaoC postmortem at Gamasutra Scott Jennings
- DaoC postmortem at Gamasutra Vincent Archer
- DaoC postmortem at Gamasutra Steve {Bloo} Daniels
- DaoC postmortem at Gamasutra Buddy Grizzard
- Skotos TT& Christopher Allen