February 1999
- client images Chris Gray
- Question on c++ switch optimization, and parsers in general. Ben Greear
- Question on c++ switch optimization, and parsers in general. Adam Wiggins
- Question on c++ switch optimization, and parsers in general. Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- Question on c++ switch optimization, and parsers in general. Chris Gray
- Question on c++ switch optimization, and parsers in general. Chris Gray
- Question on c++ switch optimization, and parsers in general. T. Alexander Popiel
- Question on c++ switch optimization, and parsers in general. Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- Question on c++ switch optimization, and parsers in general. Richard Woolcock
- Question on c++ switch optimization, and parsers in general. Marc Hernandez
- Question on c++ switch optimization, and parsers i Chris Gray
- Question on c++ switch optimization, and parsers i Jon A. Lambert
- Question on c++ switch optimization, and parsers i Chris Gray
- optimizing code diablo@best.com
- optimizing code Hans-Henrik Staerfeldt
- optimizing code Chris Gray
- code profiling Chris Gray
- World-file parsing and RTTI? The Arrow
- World-file parsing and RTTI? Mark Gritter
- pet peeves diablo@best.com
- pet peeves diablo@best.com
- pet peeves Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- pet peeves Marc Bowden
- pet peeves Richard Woolcock
- pet peeves Koster, Raph
- pet peeves diablo@best.com
- pet peeves Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- pet peeves Kristen Koster
- pet peeves Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- pet peeves Adam Wiggins
- pet peeves Wes Connell
- pet peeves J C Lawrence
- pet peeves Matthew Mihaly
- pet peeves Ling
- pet peeves Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- pet peeves Matthew Mihaly
- pet peeves Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- pet peeves Matthew Mihaly
- pet peeves David Bennett
- pet peeves Robert Woods
- pet peeves Wes Connell
- pet peeves Travis S. Casey
- pet peeves Matthew Mihaly
- pet peeves Neerenberg, AaronX
- pet peeves greg
- pet peeves Richard Woolcock
- pet peeves J C Lawrence
- pet peeves Martin Keegan
- pet peeves Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- pet peeves J C Lawrence
- pet peeves diablo@best.com
- pet peeves Brandon A Downey
- pet peeves diablo@best.com
- pet peeves Darren Henderson
- pet peeves diablo@best.com
- pet peeves Darren Henderson
- pet peeves Steve Houchard
- pet peeves diablo@best.com
- pet peeves Darren Henderson
- pet peeves diablo@best.com
- pet peeves Steve Houchard
- pet peeves diablo@best.com
- pet peeves Richard Woolcock
- pet peeves diablo@best.com
- pet peeves Richard Woolcock
- pet peeves Apocalypse
- pet peeves Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- pet peeves diablo@best.com
- pet peeves Adam Wiggins
- pet peeves diablo@best.com
- pet peeves Adam Wiggins
- pet peeves diablo@best.com
- pet peeves Mik Clarke
- pet peeves Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- pet peeves Travis S. Casey
- pet peeves Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- pet peeves Benjamin D. Wiechel
- pet peeves Marc Bowden
- pet peeves Matthew Mihaly
- pet peeves Mik Clarke
- pet peeves Benjamin D. Wiechel
- pet peeves Matthew Mihaly
- pet peeves Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- pet peeves Marc Bowden
- pet peeves Matthew Mihaly
- pet peeves David Bennett
- pet peeves David Bennett
- pet peeves Petri Virkkula
- pet peeves J C Lawrence
- Horror Themed Muds [was CthulhuMud Driver 6] Christopher Allen
- Horror Themed Muds [was CthulhuMud Driver 6] Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- Horror Themed Muds [was CthulhuMud Driver 6] Mik Clarke
- CthulhuMud Driver 6 Mik Clarke
- CthulhuMud Driver 6 J C Lawrence
- Mathengine Ling
- Mathengine Apocalypse
- Website update Koster, Raph
- Influential muds Koster, Raph
- Influential muds Dan Shiovitz
- Influential muds Adam Wiggins
- Influential muds Sunny Gulati
- Influential muds diablo@best.com
- Influential muds Juha Lindfors
- Influential muds Brandon J. Rickman
- Influential muds Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- Influential muds Andy Cink
- Influential muds J C Lawrence
- Influential muds Dr. Cat
- Influential muds Jay Carlson
- Influential muds Mik Clarke
- Influential muds Richard Woolcock
- Influential muds Koster, Raph
- Influential muds Mik Clarke
- Influential muds Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- Influential muds Dan Root
- Influential muds Benjamin D. Wiechel
- State of the art? Andy Cink
- State of the art? diablo@best.com
- State of the art? Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- State of the art? ##Make Nylander
- State of the art? diablo@best.com
- State of the art? Martin Keegan
- State of the art? David Bennett
- State of the art? Martin Keegan
- State of the art? Andy Cink
- State of the art? J C Lawrence
- State of the art? David Bennett
- State of the art? Matthew Mihaly
- State of the art? Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- State of the art? Matthew Mihaly
- State of the art? Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- State of the art? Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- State of the art? J C Lawrence
- State of the art? Matthew Mihaly
- State of the art? Mik Clarke
- State of the art? J C Lawrence
- The Terrorist Class Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- The Terrorist Class Mik Clarke
- Welcome To "MUD-Dev"! mud-dev-admin@kanga.nu
- IMPORTANT ADMIN: New list setup requires your attention J C Lawrence
- ADMIN: URL change J C Lawrence
- PermaDeath (was pet peeves) Marc Hernandez
- ScryMUD 1.8.7 released. Ben Greear
- PermaDeath Sayeed
- PermaDeath Ola Fosheim Grøstad
Sayeed wrote:
> If you're talking about 'immersiveness' from the point of view of a
> Role-Player, forms of permadeath implementation seem pretty attractive.
> As I see it, the goal of Role-Players is to totally divorce the idea of
> a Game from a Mud, and to completely immerse themselves in the mud
> WORLD. There, they enjoy a world of excitement and escape from the
> everyday. If they are completely immersed in the mud as a realistic
> world, then it provides enjoyment and has longevity with them.
I wasn't strictly talking about immersion as a roleplayer, but being
immersed into the environment. That is, feeling present, being in control
of your own body (my character's body is my body, and it is the real me
you are offending) etc.
There are a wide variety of roleplaying types. You have those that
roll-play (stat/strategy driven), those that go for in-context simulation
(based on history or fiction), those that go for creating a dramatic
context, those that go for mindgames etc. I am personally of the
dramatic/create-your-own-story/mindgames type, not of the simulation type
that are willing to work in the fields. I don't think immersion depends
on "realism" (newbies being an exception). I don't think roleplaying
depends upon the environment either, although the environment can provide
a good stage, with nice props and tools.
> Though all games cross over into our real lives in some ways, role-players
> want muds to do solely this. They want muds to, as much as possible, BE
> our real worlds. This is a role-player's immersion.
Hmm... If somebody harass in-character it is more easily accepted,
probably because it is not seen as being motivated by an objective
judgement about the person being harassed... MUDs are real (IRC is real
too), perhaps more real for non-roleplayers than for the roleplayers?
Roleplayers actually believe that the MUD-world IS different from the
physical world, that it is and should be entirely disconnected and
preserved as a valid "unreality". In the roleplaying paradigm no
character or moral has more intrinsic value than another which indeed is
extremely unreal compared to how we otherwise reason... Evil is not
really evil, jerks are not really jerks. If they happen to be real jerks
it doesn't matter because it is still perceived as valid as long as all
out-of-context references are avoided. (It is a paradox that being a jerk
is ok as long as we don't know that you really are a jerk :-) Perhaps I
misinterpret you here.
> Therefore,
> for role-players to be immersed in a fantasy world, for it to be their
> real world, there needs to be risk in those worlds.
Hmm... No, what I need is other people. Not dismissing risk as a tool,
but it isn't necessary... Rollplayers need risk, because rollplayers
depend upon their stats to keep them (somewhat) in character. *evil grin*
(Meaning, I don't fully agree with your "risk makes real" argument.
Making love to a physical girl is more real than having sex with a
martian robot, but HIV doesn't make it more real? What makes it real is
that having sex with a girl is something that I value and are fully
willing to participate in and believe in as a reality. Freaks that walks
around having sex with robots from outer space and talking about their
sexual stats and super bowl is something which doesn't fit into the world
which I want to believe in, I see them as the physical world snerts they
are and the immersion is ruined)
You don't need risk, but you need focus and engagement. Managing risk can
be something to focus on. When you focus on managing risk, you are less
aware of other disturbing aspects of the situation. What you need is to
"mentally remove" the components that contradicts the reality you are
immersing yourself into. Especially the unfitting ties to the physical
world.
> Using a good 'reward justifies risk' implementation, permadeath could be a
> very viable option in some muds.
Yes, but the trouble is that in player versus player, you do not seek
risk. The risk seeks you! If all you want is to let monsters deal out
different types of damage, with the most dangerous monsters in the
deepest dungeons being able to permakill then the concept becomes fairly
innocent...
--
Ola Fosheim Groestad,Norway http://www.stud.ifi.uio.no/~olag/ - PermaDeath Sayeed
- PermaDeath Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- roleplaying and immersion (was: PermaDeath) Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- Roleplaying and Immersion (was: PermaDeath) Sayeed
- Roleplaying and Immersion (was: PermaDeath) Adam Wiggins
- Roleplaying and Immersion (was: PermaDeath) J C Lawrence
- Roleplaying and Immersion (was: PermaDeath) Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- WEB: VR-stuff Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- WEB: VR-stuff J C Lawrence
- WEB: VR-stuff Mik Clarke
- WEB: VR-stuff Marian Griffith
- WEB: VR-stuff J C Lawrence
- ADMIN: The list archives are now online and fully searchable J C Lawrence
- Theories was pet peeves Wes Connell