May 2007

• [DESIGN] Developing and balancing a roleplaying system Calvin
• [ADMIN] Bounced Posts? Nick Koranda
• [Offtopic] Lend your ears to science! Mike Rozak
• [Design] [REPOST] Food in MMOs Lachek Butalek
• • [Design] [REPOST] Food in MMOs Jacob Cord
  • • [Design] [REPOST] Food in MMOs Steve "Bloo" Daniels
    • • [Design] [REPOST] Food in MMOs Damion Schubert
      • • [DESIGN} Who to design for? John Buehler
        • • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Damion Schubert
          • • [DESIGN} Who to design for? John Buehler
            • • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Tess Snider
              • • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Sean Howard
                • • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Raph Koster
                  • • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Sean Howard
                    • • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Raph Koster
                      • • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Sean Howard
                        • • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Caliban Darklock
                          • • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Sean Howard
                            • • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Caliban Darklock
                              • • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Sean Howard
                                • • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Caliban Darklock
                                  • [DESIGN} Who to design for? cruise
                                  • [DESIGN} Who to design for? John MacQueen
                              • "The Next Big Thing" (was [DESIGN} Who to design for?) Mike Sellers
                              • • "The Next Big Thing" (was [DESIGN} Who to design for?) Sean Howard
                                • • "The Next Big Thing" (was [DESIGN} Who to design for?) Peter Keeler
                          • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Michael Chui
                          • [DESIGN] Who to design for? Michael Hartman
                      • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Damion Schubert
                      • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Caliban Darklock
                  • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Tess Snider
                  • • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Sean Howard
            • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Sean Howard
            • • [DESIGN} Who to design for? cruise
              • • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Sean Howard
                • • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Caliban Darklock
                    On 5/21/07, Sean Howard <squidi@squidi.net> wrote:
                    >
                    > I think everyone can get all sorts of themes.
                    
                    I think it's a little different when you get success and failure
                    involved. You can't fail at a movie; you just don't like it, which is
                    a form of success. The success conditions of a movie are "see the
                    movie and grasp the plot", which are accessible to anyone and everyone
                    of reasonable intelligence. Indeed, they're inevitable, if you just
                    walk into the theatre and sit down.
                    
                    > We see something LIKE Star Trek come out and bomb, and then we jump
                    > to this conclusion that normal people just don't "get it".
                    
                    I think what's missing there is the examination of what makes
                    something unlike Star Trek. You can watch and enjoy Star Trek with
                    absolutely NO CLUE what a dilithium matrix is or what a jeffreys tube
                    is for or how phasers differ from disruptors or even the difference
                    between warp drive and impulse drive. Many Star Trek viewers are
                    effectively translating the conversation into Pakled. They see Geordi
                    come out and say something like this:
                    
                    "Captain, the dilithium matrix is destabilised, and we can't use warp
                    drive for several hours. We're limited to impulse engines while I
                    climb through the jeffreys tube and reinitialise the system."
                    
                    And the filters kick in:
                    
                    "Captain, IT IS BROKEN, and we can't GO FAST for several hours. We're
                    limited to GOING SLOW while I climb through THAT and FIX IT."
                    
                    The same thing happens when you get the detailed examination of
                    disruptor and phaser fire during an investigation. "It was disruptor
                    fire! See, look at this CONVINCING EVIDENCE." The viewer doesn't have
                    to understand the convincing evidence, he just needs to see that the
                    people looking at it understand it, and that they regard it as
                    convincing. That's good enough.
                    
                    But in a game context, you can't make that translation, because you're
                    expected to give the command to fix it. So when someone in the game
                    says "the dilithium matrix is destabilised" you're sitting there lost
                    in this quagmire of jargon and unable to make a rational decision. You
                    don't have any cues about what this means. "WTF is dilithium? My
                    sister takes lithium. Is my crew going off their medication?"
                    
                    > Normal people can get WoW because the things don't need to get aren't
                    > really that important.
                    
                    Um, yeah. More or less. I just rambled a lot more. ;)
                    
                    > I don't think the casual gamer is against learning something new.
                    
                    I think what worries the casual gamer isn't the idea that it's
                    something new, but that it's something which - once learned - will
                    provide advantage. This is, of course, an incentive to learn... until
                    you factor in the percentage of the playerbase that already knows it.
                    Nobody likes to feel stupid, and if the crowd around you knows
                    something you don't, you feel stupid.
                    
                    I think there's a big fat part of a game's life cycle where you've
                    already locked in your core player base, and until they move far
                    enough along that they're a fringe element, the mainstream won't touch
                    the game. The game has three important stages - one at the beginning
                    where everyone who joins will be a "playa" simply because competition
                    is minimal, one in the middle where only the elite get to succeed
                    because competition is massive, and then one at the end where
                    competition is reasonable because the elite have either moved on or
                    are now playing a whole different type of game. Only "regular folk"
                    are signing on and playing the main game, and most of them are
                    comparable. That's where the game needs to be sustainable, in the end.
                    
                    > Again, I don't think complexity has anything to do with it. Blizzard games
                    > are generally on the upper end of complexity for your average game.
                    
                    But the learning curve - while admittedly long - is shallow. Starcraft
                    builds, mission after mission, so that you initially work with limited
                    units and limited ideas. Over time, you become accustomed to the
                    gameplay. Diablo has early levels where stats are largely irrelevant,
                    and it's only as you get much deeper into the game that you need to
                    track stats.
                    
                    It's the bite-sized pieces that do it. You simply can't play level 9
                    without going through level 5, so level 9 can assume with reasonable
                    certainty that you must know how to beat level 5. The only time that
                    really misleads is when friends or siblings are switching off playing
                    the game, and the guy who beat level 5 has gone home or is at softball
                    practice.
                    
                    > I don't think it works that way. Being a hardcore gamer isn't something
                    > you can learn to do.
                    
                    Agreed. There is something fundamentally different in the mindset; I'm
                    playing Dead Rising over and over this week, not because I'm having so
                    much fun with it, but because I'm convinced that I can accomplish a
                    particular goal within 24 hours of game time. Every time I hit that 24
                    hour mark and haven't accomplished it, no matter how close I am, I
                    start over. That's hardcore gaming behavior.
                    
                    Most people don't get it. You accomplished the goal, right? Why do you
                    need to do it in 24 hours? What will that give you? Well, nothing.
                    I'll just know I did it in 24 hours. And to the hardcore gamer, that's
                    enough.
                    
                    But the fear of failure part still kicks in. I don't want to say what
                    the goal is, because I'd really rather not risk other people on the
                    list saying "THAT takes you more than 24 hours?! I did it in twelve!"
                    and making me feel like a loser. ;)
                  • • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Sean Howard
                    • • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Caliban Darklock
                      • • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Sean Howard
                        • • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Caliban Darklock
                          • • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Sean Howard
                            • • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Dana V. Baldwin
                              • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Caliban Darklock
                              • • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Sean Howard
                                • • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Caliban Darklock
                                  • • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Sean Howard
                                    • • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Caliban Darklock
              • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Mike Sellers
            • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Tess Snider
            • • [Design] 4Cs (was Who to design for?) Mike Sellers
              • • [Design] 4Cs (was Who to design for?) Sean Howard
                • • [Design] 4Cs (was Who to design for?) Mike Sellers
                  • • [Design] 4Cs (was Who to design for?) Sean Howard
                    • • [Design] 4Cs (was Who to design for?) Michael Chui
                  • [Design] 4Cs (was Who to design for?) Peter Keeler
                  • • [Design] 4Cs (was Who to design for?) Ammon Lauritzen
                    • [Design] 4Cs (was Who to design for?) Sean Howard
                    • • [Design] 4Cs (was Who to design for?) Lachek Butalek
                      • [Design] 4Cs (was Who to design for?) Dana V. Baldwin
          • [DESIGN} Who to design for? cruise
          • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Sean Howard
          • [DESIGN} Who to design for? Caliban Darklock
        • [Design] [REPOST] Food in MMOs Steve "Bloo" Daniels
        • • [Design] [REPOST] Food in MMOs Caliban Darklock
          • • [Design] [REPOST] Food in MMOs cruise
            • [Design] [REPOST] Food in MMOs Steve "Bloo" Daniels
  • [Design] [REPOST] Food in MMOs Tess Snider
  • • [Design] [REPOST] Food in MMOs Lachek Butalek
    • • [Design] [REPOST] Food in MMOs Michael Chui
      • [Design] [REPOST] Food in MMOs Ian Hess
      • [Design] [REPOST] Food in MMOs Ian Hess
      • [Design] [REPOST] Food in MMOs Tess Snider
      • • [Design] [REPOST] Food in MMOs Lachek Butalek
        • • [Design] [REPOST] Food in MMOs Michael Hartman
          • • [Design] [REPOST] Food in MMOs Kiztent
            • [Design] [REPOST] Food in MMOs Jean, Yannick
            • • [Design] [REPOST] Food in MMOs Michael Hartman
              • • [Design] [REPOST] Food in MMOs Vincent Archer
                • • [Design] [REPOST] Food in MMOs Dave Scheffer
          • [Design] [REPOST] Food in MMOs Tess Snider
          • [Design] [REPOST] Food in MMOs Michael Chui
  • [Design] [REPOST] Food in MMOs John Buehler
  • [Design] [REPOST] Food in MMOs Morris Cox
  • • [Design] [REPOST] Food in MMOs Dana V. Baldwin
    • • [Design] [REPOST] Food in MMOs Matt Chatterley
      • • [Design] [REPOST] Food in MMOs Dana V. Baldwin
        • [Design] [REPOST] Food in MMOs Michael Chui
        • • [Design] Obstacles and Hindrances [was: Food in MMOs & Perma-death] cruise
• [DESIGN] Perma-death cruise
• • [DESIGN] Perma-death Dana V. Baldwin
  • • [DESIGN] Perma-death Steve "Bloo" Daniels
  • [DESIGN] Perma-death Nick Koranda
  • • [DESIGN] Perma-death cruise
  • [DESIGN] Perma-death Damion Schubert
  • • [DESIGN] Perma-death cruise
    • • [DESIGN] Perma-death Dana V. Baldwin
      • • [DESIGN] Perma-death Steve "Bloo" Daniels
        • • [DESIGN] Perma-death cruise
          • • [DESIGN] Perma-death Steve "Bloo" Daniels
            • [DESIGN] Perma-death Jeffrey Kesselman
  • [DESIGN] Perma-death Tess Snider
  • • [DESIGN] Perma-death Cory Cohen
    • [DESIGN] Perma-death Matt Chatterley
    • [DESIGN] Perma-death Craig Huber
    • • [JOBS] Areae hiring Raph Koster
    • [DESIGN] Perma-death Phillip Lenhardt
    • • [DESIGN] Perma-death Jeffrey Kesselman
      • [DESIGN] Perma-death Jeffrey Kesselman
      • • [DESIGN] Perma-death Tess Snider
        • • [DESIGN] Perma-death Jeffrey Kesselman
          • • [DESIGN] Perma-death Tess Snider
            • • [DESIGN] Perma-death Jeffrey Kesselman
              • • [DESIGN] Perma-death Dave Scheffer
                • • [DESIGN] Perma-death Dana V. Baldwin
                  • • [DESIGN] Perma-death Dave Scheffer
          • [DESIGN] Perma-death Matt Chatterley
          • [DESIGN] Perma-death cruise
          • • [DESIGN] Perma-death Caliban Darklock
            • • [DESIGN] Perma-death cruise
              • [DESIGN] Perma-death Dana V. Baldwin
              • • [DESIGN] Perma-death cruise
        • [DESIGN] Perma-death Caliban Darklock
        • • [DESIGN] Perma-death Dana V. Baldwin
          • • [DESIGN] Perma-death Peter Keeler
            • • [DESIGN] Perma-death Dana V. Baldwin
              • • [DESIGN] Perma-death Peter Keeler
                • • [DESIGN] Perma-death Jeffrey Kesselman
                  • • [DESIGN] Perma-death Peter Keeler
                    • [DESIGN] Perma-death Michael Chui
      • [DESIGN] Perma-death Soy weiser
      • • [DESIGN] Perma-death Ammon Lauritzen
        • [DESIGN] Perma-death Jeffrey Kesselman
  • [DESIGN] Perma-death Ammon Lauritzen
  • • [DESIGN] Perma-death Dana V. Baldwin
  • [DESIGN] Perma-death John Buehler
  • [DESIGN] Perma-death Hans Häggström
  • • [DESIGN] Perma-death cruise
• [NEWS] Sigil / Vanguard fallout ... the ex-employee interview Adam Martin
• • [NEWS] Sigil / Vanguard fallout ... the ex-employeeinterview Morgan Ramsay
  • [NEWS] Sigil / Vanguard fallout ... the ex-employee interview Sean Howard
  • • [NEWS] Sigil / Vanguard fallout ... the ex-employee interview Adam Martin
    • • [NEWS] Sigil / Vanguard fallout ... the ex-employee interview Sean Howard
      • • [NEWS] Sigil / Vanguard fallout ... the ex-employee interview Mike Sellers
        • • [NEWS] Sigil / Vanguard fallout ... the ex-employee interview Michael Zenke
          • [NEWS] Sigil / Vanguard fallout ... the ex-employee interview Sean Howard
          • [NEWS] Sigil / Vanguard fallout ... the ex-employeeinterview Mike Rozak
          • • [NEWS] Sigil / Vanguard fallout ... the ex-employeeinterview Mike Sellers
    • [NEWS] Sigil / Vanguard fallout ... the ex-employee interview Caliban Darklock
  • [NEWS] Sigil / Vanguard fallout ... the ex-employeeinterview Mike Rozak
  • • [NEWS] Sigil / Vanguard fallout ... the ex-employeeinterview Sean Howard
• Fwd: [NEWS] Sigil / Vanguard fallout ... the ex-employeeinterview Adam Martin
• [DESIGN] Mechanical support for socializer playstyles Ian Hess
• • [DESIGN] Mechanical support for socializer playstyles Michael Chui
  • • [DESIGN] Mechanical support for socializer playstyles Ian Hess
  • [DESIGN] Mechanical support for socializer playstyles Michael Chui
  • • [DESIGN] Mechanical support for socializer playstyles cruise
• [TECH] Creating games with Worldforge Roger D Vargas
• • [TECH] Creating games with Worldforge Alistair Riddoch
  • • [TECH] Creating games with Worldforge Roger D Vargas
  • [TECH] Creating games with Worldforge Tess Snider
  • • [TECH] Creating games with Worldforge Roger D Vargas
    • • [TECH] Creating games with Worldforge Lachek Butalek
      • [TECH] Creating games with Worldforge Tess Snider
      • • [TECH] Creating games with Worldforge Roger D Vargas
        • • [TECH] Creating games with Worldforge Tess Snider
• The Merits of Text Chat (Was: Importance of emoting) Michael Hartman
• • The Merits of Text Chat (Was: Importance of emoting) Matt Chatterley
• [Design] Alternatives To Advancement Systems (was Food in MMOs) Caliban Darklock
• [DESIGN] Essence of a MMO (was 4Cs) Dana V. Baldwin
• • [DESIGN] Essence of a MMO (was 4Cs) Caliban Darklock
  • [DESIGN] Essence of a MMO (was 4Cs) Sean Howard
  • • [DESIGN] Essence of a MMO (was 4Cs) Dana V. Baldwin
• [TECH] Server Side Scripting Roger D Vargas
• • [TECH] Server Side Scripting Caliban Darklock
  • [TECH] Server Side Scripting Richard Tew
  • [TECH] Server Side Scripting Ammon Lauritzen
  • [TECH] Server Side Scripting Jeffrey Kesselman