May 2002
- Random Resets John Robert Arras
- Random Resets Kwon Ekstrom
- Random Resets John Robert Arras
- [MLP] The use of ecology models Rayzam
- Interesting things to do (was: Player Accounts on a Non-Commercial MUD) John Buehler
- Apple WWDC? amanda@alfar.com
- Apple WWDC? Nathan F. Yospe
- Apple WWDC? Amanda Walker
- Apple WWDC? Sasha Hart
- Apple WWDC? amanda@alfar.com
- Apple WWDC? Brian Hook
- Apple WWDC? John A. Bertoglio
- Apple WWDC? Daniel.Harman@barclayscapital.com
- Apple WWDC? Matt Mihaly
- Apple WWDC? shren
- Apple WWDC? Matt Mihaly
- Apple WWDC? John A. Bertoglio
- Apple WWDC? James Edward Gray II
- Apple WWDC? Brian Hook
- Encouraging groups without grouping Brian 'Psychochild' Green
- Introduction and My solution to Powergamers, Treadmills, and Content Devaluation. Ken Raisor
- The audience is the medium. For now. John Szeder
- The audience is the medium. For now. John Buehler
- The audience is the medium. For now. Damion Schubert
- The audience is the medium. For now. Ted L. Chen
- The audience is the medium. For now. Shane Gough
- The audience is the medium. For now. Michael Tresca
- The audience is the medium. For now. Ted L. Chen
- The audience is the medium. For now. Marian Griffith
- The audience is the medium. For now. Vincent Archer
- The audience is the medium. For now. Damion Schubert
- The audience is the medium. For now. David B. Held
- The audience is the medium. For now. Ted L. Chen
- The audience is the medium. For now. Marian Griffith
- The audience is the medium. For now. F. Randall Farmer
- The audience is the medium. For now. J C Lawrence
- The audience is the medium. For now. Frank Crowell
- Ownership of characters Jasper McChesney
- Explorers? (Was: Codename Blue & Facets - Nick Yee's new studies) Brian 'Psychochild' Green
- Befriending Critters (was: Random Resets) Arthaey
- Questions about server design Ben Chambers
- Questions about server design Michael Bayne
- Questions about server design Sean Middleditch
- Questions about server design Mike Shaver
- Questions about server design Kwon Ekstrom
- Questions about server design szii@sziisoft.com
- Questions about server design F. Randall Farmer
- Questions about server design James Edward Gray II
- Questions about server design Shane Gough
- Extensibility Ben Chambers
- Extensibility Ammon Lauritzen
- Extensibility Kwon Ekstrom
- Extensibility Ben Chambers
- Extensibility "Christopher {siege} " OBrien
- Extensibility Sean Middleditch
- Extensibility Sean Kelly
- Extensibility John Buehler
- Extensibility shren
- Extensibility John Buehler
- Extensibility szii@sziisoft.com
- Extensibility John Buehler
- Extensibility szii@sziisoft.com
- Extensibility Mike Shaver
- Question: Any published research on Sims type game personae? susan wu
- [MLP] Why care about levels? (was: The use of ecolo Richard Woolcock
- [MLP] Why care about levels? (was: The use of ecolo gy models) Jon Lambert
- Component Design (was: Extensibility) Scion Altera
- [BIZ] Selling Stock (formerly Blacksnow revisted ) Robert A. Rice, Jr.
- Games are Hot. Period Michael Tresca
- Games are Hot. Period Gladimir
- Games are Hot. Period Richard Aihoshi aka Jonric
- Games are Hot. Period Freeman, Jeff
- Games are Hot. Period Richard Aihoshi aka Jonric
- Games are Hot. Period Koster, Raph
- Games are Hot. Period Vincent Archer
- Games are Hot. Period Richard Aihoshi aka Jonric
- Games are Hot. Period Matt Mihaly
- fun Matt Mihaly
- [TECH] Shortest Path William Murdick
- [TECH] Voice in MO* - Phoneme Decomposition and Reconstruction Ted L. Chen
- [TECH] Voice in MO* - Phoneme Decomposition and Reconstruction John Buehler
- [TECH] Voice in MO* - Phoneme Decomposition and Reconstruction Ted L. Chen
- [TECH] Voice in MO* - Phoneme Decomposition and Reconstruction Eli Stevens
- [TECH] Voice in MO* - Phoneme Decomposition and Reconstruction Jon Leonard
- [TECH] Voice in MO* - Phoneme Decomposition and Reconstruction Hans-Henrik Staerfeldt
- [TECH] Voice in MO* - Phoneme Decomposition and Rec onstruction Robert Zubek
- [TECH] Voice in MO* - Phoneme Decomposition and Rec onstruction ceo@grexengine.com
- [TECH] Voice in MO* - Phoneme Decomposition and Reconstruction Hans-Henrik Staerfeldt
- [TECH] Voice in MO* - Phoneme Decomposition and Reconstruction Ted L. Chen
- [TECH] Voice in MO* - Phoneme Decomposition and Rec onstruction Koster, Raph
- [TECH] Voice in MO* - Phoneme Decomposition and Rec onstruction lynx@lynx.purrsia.com
- [TECH] Voice in MO* - Phoneme Decomposition and Reconstruction Ted L. Chen
- [TECH] Voice in MO* - Phoneme Decomposition and Reconstruction Rudy Neeser
- [TECH] Voice in MO* - Phoneme Decomposition and Reconstruction Matt Mihaly
- [TECH] Voice in MO* - Phoneme Decomposition and Rec onstruction Daniel.Harman@barclayscapital.com
- [TECH] Voice in MO* - Phoneme Decomposition and Reconstruction John Buehler
- [TECH] Voice in MO* - Phoneme Decomposition and Reconstruction Ted L. Chen
- [TECH] Voice in MO* - Phoneme Decomposition and Reconstruction Mike Shaver
- [TECH] Voice in MO* - Phoneme Decomposition and Reconstruction John Buehler
- [TECH] Voice in MO* - Phoneme Decomposition and Reconstruction amanda@alfar.com
- [TECH] Voice in MO* - Phoneme Decomposition and Rec onstruction Koster, Raph
- [TECH] Voice in MO* - Phoneme Decomposition and Rec onstruction Steve {Bloo} Daniels
- Combat with Style (was Player Accounts on a Non-Commercial MUD) lynx@lynx.purrsia.com
- Playskins Koster, Raph
- People were talking about resets.. Anderson, David
- People were talking about resets.. Sasha Hart
- People were talking about resets.. Anderson, David
- People were talking about resets.. John Buehler
- People were talking about resets.. Anderson, David
- People were talking about resets.. Arnau Rossell=?US-ASCII?Q?=F3?= Castell=?US-ASCII?Q?=F3?=
- People were talking about resets.. shren
- People were talking about resets.. Anderson, David
- People were talking about resets.. David B. Held
- People were talking about resets.. shren
- People were talking about resets.. Anderson, David
- People were talking about resets.. Michael Tresca
- People were talking about resets.. Fred Clift
- People were talking about resets.. Lars Duening
- People were talking about resets.. Michael Tresca
- People were talking about resets.. Rayzam
- People were talking about resets.. Matt Mihaly
- People were talking about resets.. Tand'a-ur
- People were talking about resets.. John Buehler
- People were talking about resets.. Leland Hulbert II
- People were talking about resets.. lynx@lynx.purrsia.com
- People were talking about resets.. Jason Murdick
- People were talking about resets.. Jeff Lindsey
- People were talking about resets.. Ben Chambers
- People were talking about resets.. Sasha Hart
- People were talking about resets.. David B. Held
- People were talking about resets.. Sasha Hart
- People were talking about resets.. Anderson, David
- People were talking about resets.. David B. Held
- People were talking about resets.. Acius
- People were talking about resets.. Marian Griffith
- Question about copyovers. Anderson, David
- Question about copyovers. Tand'a-ur
- Question about copyovers. Anderson, David
- Question about copyovers. Kwon Ekstrom
- Question about copyovers. Adam
- Question about copyovers. Oliver Jowett
- Question about copyovers. Kwon Ekstrom
- Question about copyovers. Lars Duening
- Question about copyovers. Jon Lambert
- Question about copyovers. fred@clift.org
- Question about copyovers. Zach Collins {Siege}
- Question about copyovers. Smith, David {Lynchburg}
- non-violent activities (was People were talking about resets..) Ammon Lauritzen
- References on personality and emotion models Robert Zubek
- Multimodal interface conference. Rayzam
- Hyperbolies R Us shren
- Hyperbolies R Us Matt Mihaly
- TECH: Systems Administration Issues Thomas Leavitt
- Questions about ... XML as data format Adam
- Questions about ... XML as data format Anderson, David
- Questions about ... XML as data format Kwon Ekstrom
- R&D Matt Mihaly
- Conversation logs? Robert Zubek
- Conversation logs? Rudy Fink
- Conversation logs? Vincent Archer
- Conversation logs? Shane Gough
- DGN: Elastic Advancement in MUDs? Jeff Lindsey
- DGN: Elastic Advancement in MUDs? David B. Held
- Building histories off civilizations automatically adam Martin
- ADMIN: Virii and mail forgeries J C Lawrence
- Hi from the Dragon Empire's CLM Peter Tyson
- Linux gaming ( was Apple WWDC? ) Kevin Mack
- [TECH] Preferred LPC replacement? Jeff Bachtel
- [TECH] Preferred LPC replacement? Damion Schubert
- Who `owns' conversation logs? Joshua Judson Rosen
- The Online Gaming Life for Me! Michael Tresca
- Boredom Ben Chambers
- Law of Diminishing Marginal Utility [was Boredom] Ron Gabbard
- Law of Diminishing Marginal Utility [was Boredom] Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- "MMOG" Bible Brian 'Psychochild' Green
- "MMOG" Bible David Kennerly
- TECH: Single process v.s. multi process? Philip Mak
- TECH: Single process v.s. multi process? Smith, David {Lynchburg}
- TECH: Single process v.s. multi process? Bruce Mitchener
- TECH: Single process v.s. multi process? Bruce Mitchener
- In defense of "soloability" [was Law of Diminishing Marginal Utility] Clay
- In defense of "soloability" [was Law of Diminishing Marginal Utility] apollyon
- In defense of "soloability" [was Law of Diminishing Marginal Utility] Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- In defense of "soloability" [was Law of Diminishi ng Marginal Utility] Koster, Raph
- In defense of "soloability" [was Law of Diminishing Marginal Utility] Michael Tresca
- In defense of "soloability" [was Law of Diminishing Marginal Utility] Paul Schwanz
- In defense of "soloability" [was Law of Diminishing Marginal Utility] Martin C. Martin
- In defense of "soloability" [was Law of Diminishing Marginal Utility] Dave Rickey
- In defense of "soloability" [was Law of Diminishing Marginal Utility] Sanvean
- In defense of "soloability" [was Law of Diminishing Marginal Utility] Matt Mihaly
- In defense of "soloability" [was Law of Diminishing Marginal Utility] Michael Tresca
- In defense of "soloability" [was Law of Diminishing Marginal Utility] Kwon Ekstrom
- In defense of "soloability" [was Law of Diminishing Marginal Utility] Ron Gabbard
- Game shows Peter Tyson
- What keeps people interested in social muds? Martin C. Martin
- What keeps people interested in social muds? Rudy Fink
- What keeps people interested in social muds? Martin C. Martin
- What keeps people interested in social muds? Joshua Judson Rosen
- What keeps people interested in social muds? Ron Gabbard
- What keeps people interested in social muds? Marc Bowden
- What keeps people interested in social muds? Joshua Judson Rosen
- What keeps people interested in social muds? lynx@lynx.purrsia.com
- What keeps people interested in social muds? Richard A. Bartle
- What keeps people interested in social muds? Martin C. Martin
- What keeps people interested in social muds? Richard A. Bartle
- New Beginings Drylar Levre
- New Beginings Acius
- New Beginings ceo@grexengine.com
- New Beginings Bruce Mitchener
- New Beginings David B. Held
- New Beginings Kwon Ekstrom
- New Beginings David B. Held
- New Beginings Kwon Ekstrom
From: "David B. Held" <dheld@codelogicconsulting.com>
> From: "Kwon Ekstrom" <justice@softhome.net>
>> Actually JVM's are VASTLY improved, if you look at performance
>> comparisons, primitive operations are withing nanoseconds of c++.
>> Java's real slowdown is actually from overridden methods. I'm
>> sure someone will tackle that problem shortly.
> With templates? ;)
I've never used c templates, so I won't comment on them...
>> I don't see how direct allocation will drastically improve my
>> mud's performance. I simply cache my objects and don't pay the
>> allocation fee repeatedly. I don't need to dump objects
>> constantly so the GC isn't a major issue.
> If your load is relatively stable, and doesn't spike, then caching
> is a fine solution. But if you have any allocation spikes, you
> are
Spiking isn't a problem since mobs and items and most of the cached
objects in the world don't go away. There's no reason to
de-allocate a mob or an item if you know it's going to repop.
> either going to end up with a fat, empty cache, or you're going to
> wait for the GC to reclaim the unused objects all at once. With
An empty cache isn't a bad thing, it means you're not wasting
memory, as for garbage collecting alot of objects at once, it's
doubtful that many objects are going to be disposed in that short of
a period. Plus it's not a "flat" cache. It checks the usage load
to determine how large a pool to maintain.
> refcounting, you pay for deallocation as soon as the object's
> lifetime is over. The insignificant cost of adjusting the
> refcount is more than justified by the optimal memory usage. And
> if you use a pool allocator with a smart resource, you can have
> automagic caching.
Working in c, I've noticed alot of things are prone to memory leaks,
the cost in time alone to debug these memory leaks is enormous. You
have to maintain strict conventions on how to handle things, and a
flaw somewhere in that convention can introduce a memory leak that's
difficult to find. Alot of so called "industrial strength" software
has problems with memory leaks and crashing (played with windows or
office lately?)
Most of the c/c++ coders I know of have nightmares about memory
leaks in their code because they're so difficult to track down.
Speed of allocation in java is slower, and the GC does have it's
issues... but I've never had issues with performance except with
the java.io package. Using java.nio alot of those concerns have
disappeared. Used correctly, I have no doubts in my mind that
direct allocation is faster, and can be more efficient. In practice
what's the percentage?
>> The simple fact is, what performance gains I'd receive using C++
>> are overcome by the development tools I get from java.
> That's funny. C++ has a much broader user base and toolset. It's
> also more mature, and has far more libraries than any other
> lanugage
I'm quite positive that there are more libraries available for c
than there are for java, but I've yet to run across things I "can't"
do in java reasonably well... granted I'm not trying to setup a
high-end 3d client side application, or write device
drivers... there are definitely things that c does better.
Then there's cost, alot of the tools that you get free for java
costs to get a similar product for c, and those costs are
substantial. I don't know if you've ever visited Topcoder.com but
they've mentioned that the vast majority of people competing on
their servers use java... why? It's alot faster to write the same
program and have it run with acceptable speed and fulfill the design
requirements.
>> You have to know what language you're writing in... the same
>> techniques don't work in all languages.
> Granted. Which is why I'm always suspicious when someone says
> that <interpreted, GC language X> is "basically as fast as C++".
> The person who wrote the benchmarks to "prove" that probably
> doesn't know jack about C++.
From every post you've written on the subject just tells me that you
don't know jack about performance in other languages. I won't tell
you that Java is faster than C/C++ but I will tell you that for
primitive operations, java is within nanoseconds of c/c++. I will
tell you that depending on the operation that java is withing 1-3%
of c/c++ for object method calls.
The problem is I can't tell you exactly how fast java works, that
depends primarily on OS/JVM implementation. There's alot of details
that go into determining how fast your code will run in Java. I
have experience in c/c++ but it's not extensive. I have several
professional friends in that area which agree with me. C/C++ is
"better" at doing things "if" you know what you're doing. Java
allows faster development with fewer bugs, has a large well
documented and easy to use toolset. Has acceptable performance.
Allows easy documentation of your own source.
Use the tool that you need for the job, I absolutely hate VB, but
I've used it... why? Because sometimes I needed to rapidly develop
a graphical application using COM. Would I write something like a
back-end server in VB? Absolutely not. Javascript is slow (even
compared to java) but I've used it as well... for simple tasks that
need done on a windows server.
Lately I've been writing AWK scripts for a friend of mine who needs
them at his work (ironically they're using a korn shell emulator on
a windows 2000 server)
Going back to C/C++, your compiler generates Assembly language (yes
that's your object files there) which then get compiled into an
executable binary. Would you then recommend that people learn
Assembly? (Some of my friends have learned assembly to further
optimize their code post compiling pre-linking)
There are tools I'd like to see for Java. A pre-compiler to allow
macro defines and whatnot is definitely something that I miss from
programming in c/c++.
-- Kwon J. Ekstrom - New Beginings Sean Kelly
- New Beginings Kwon Ekstrom
- New Beginings Lars Duening
- New Beginings David B. Held
- New Beginings Lars Duening
- New Beginings Bruce Mitchener
- New Beginings David B. Held
- New Beginings Kwon Ekstrom
- New Beginings Paul Schwanz
- New Beginings Zach Collins {Siege}
- New Beginings Miroslav Silovic
- New Beginings David B. Held
- New Beginings Draymoor a Vin il'Rogina
- New Beginings David B. Held
- New Beginings Kwon Ekstrom
- New Beginings Bruce Mitchener
- [DGN] Creating a MUD Richard Krush
- [DGN] Creating a MUD Acius
- [DGN] Creating a MUD Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- [DGN] Creating a MUD Edward Glowacki
- [DGN] Creating a MUD Kwon Ekstrom
- [DGN] Creating a MUD Edward Glowacki
- [DGN] Creating a MUD Fred Clift
- [DGN] Creating a MUD David Bennett
- [DGN] Creating a MUD fred@clift.org
- [DGN] Creating a MUD Damion Schubert
- [DGN] Creating a MUD Taylor
- [DGN] Creating a MUD Matt Mihaly
- [DGN] Creating a MUD Daniel.Harman@barclayscapital.com
- On the creation of constructive/social behaviours in online games! Marc Demesel
- [DGN] MUD Books James Edward Gray II
- [DGN] MUD Books Scion Altera
- [DGN] MUD Books Jeremy Noetzelman
- [DGN] MUD Books Tand'a-ur
- Positive reinforcement for socializing [was In de fense of "soloability" ] Jeff Lindsey
- Character skill distribution and trade-offs Ron Gabbard
- Character skill distribution and trade-offs Daniel.Harman@barclayscapital.com
- Character skill distribution and trade-offs Vincent Archer
- Character skill distribution and trade-offs Daniel.Harman@barclayscapital.com
- Character skill distribution and trade-offs John Buehler
- Character skill distribution and trade-offs Sean Kelly
- Character skill distribution and trade-offs Ron Gabbard
- Space partitioning, R-Trees? Dread Quixadhal
- Space partitioning, R-Trees? Daniel.Harman@barclayscapital.com
- Space partitioning, R-Trees? Hans-Henrik Staerfeldt
- Space partitioning, R-Trees? Crosbie Fitch