September 2001
- Strix: Object Persistence on Relational Backends Ling Lo
- Structured Social Play John Buehler
- Structured Social Play Tom Hubina
- Structured Social Play Christopher Allen
- Structured Social Play Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- Structured Social Play Daniel Bendiksen
- Structured Social Play Tamzen Cannoy
- Structured Social Play Robin Lee Powell
- Structured Social Play Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- Structured Social Play Travis Casey
- Structured Social Play Robin Lee Powell
- Structured Social Play Christopher Allen
- Structured Social Play Koster, Raph
- Structured Social Play Matthew D. Fuller
- Structured Social Play Bruce Mitchener
- Structured Social Play Takis Kalogiratos
- Structured Social Play shren
- Structured Social Play Daniel Bendiksen
- Structured Social Play shren
- Structured Social Play Matt Owen
- Structured Social Play Bruce Mitchener
- Structured Social Play Vincent Archer
- Structured Social Play shren
- Structured Social Play Daniel Bendiksen
- Structured Social Play Vincent Archer
- Structured Social Play John Buehler
- Structured Social Play Matt Mihaly
- Structured Social Play Marian Griffith
- Structured Social Play Travis Nixon
- NEWS: Blizzard Entertainment announces World of Warcraft Kylotan
- [BIZ] Billing systems Brian Hook
- [BIZ] Billing systems Matt Mihaly
- [BIZ] Billing systems Christopher Allen
- [BIZ] Billing systems Brian Hook
- [BIZ] Billing systems Christopher Allen
- [BIZ] Billing systems Kevin Littlejohn
- [BIZ] Billing systems Travis Nixon
- [BIZ] Billing systems Brian Hook
- [BIZ] Billing systems Daniel.Harman@barclayscapital.com
- [BIZ] Billing systems Owen
- [BIZ] Billing systems Jussi 'Sulka' Haro
- [BIZ] Billing systems Peter Tyson
- Benchmarking MUDs Chris Gray
- Benchmarking MUDs Matt Mihaly
- Benchmarking MUDs Bruce Mitchener
- Benchmarking MUDs Lars Duening
- Benchmarking MUDs Adam Martin
- Benchmarking MUDs Robin Lee Powell
- Benchmarking MUDs Chris Gray
- Benchmarking MUDs Adam Martin
- Benchmarking MUDs Chris Gray
- Benchmarking MUDs Ian Collyer
- Benchmarking MUDs Chris Gray
- Benchmarking MUDs Adam Martin
- Benchmarking MUDs Jon Lambert
- Free Time != Advancement (was: Structured Social Play) Eli Stevens
- Random American Name Generator (!) Ling Lo
- Higher barrier to entry? was NEWS: Blizzard Entertainment announces World of Warcraft Brian Hook
- Higher barrier to entry? was NEWS: Blizzard Entertainment announces World of Warcraft Christopher Allen
- Higher barrier to entry? was NEWS: Blizzard Entertainment announces World of Warcraft Derek Licciardi
- Higher barrier to entry? was NEWS: Blizzard Entertainment announces World of Warcraft Sean K
- Higher barrier to entry? was NEWS: Blizzard Ent ertainment announces World of Warcraft Daniel.Harman@barclayscapital.com
- Updated my site Koster, Raph
- Vircom T4C Brian Hook
- Vircom T4C Valerio Santinelli
- Preference for host OS Brian Hook
- Preference for host OS Jon Leonard
- Preference for host OS Bruce Mitchener
- Preference for host OS brandon@roguetrader.com
- Preference for host OS J C Lawrence
- Preference for host OS Jeremy Noetzelman
- Preference for host OS Fred Clift
- Preference for host OS Travis Casey
- Preference for host OS J C Lawrence
- Preference for host OS Travis Casey
- Preference for host OS Sean K
- Preference for host OS Vincent Archer
- Preference for host OS Phillip Lenhardt
- Preference for host OS J C Lawrence
- Preference for host OS J C Lawrence
- Preference for host OS Brian Hook
- Preference for host OS Brian Tackett
- Preference for host OS Jon Lambert
- Preference for host OS David Loeser
- Preference for host OS Brian Hook
- TEC Distribuate engine &cost of band width Stéphane Garin
- TEC Distribuate engine &cost of band width plalande@born2play.org
- [MUD DEV] Text editors in MUDs [was Structured Social Play] Daniel Bendiksen
- [MUD DEV] Text editors in MUDs [was Structured Social Play] Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- [MUD DEV] Text editors in MUDs [was Structured Social Play] Derek Licciardi
- [MUD DEV] Text editors in MUDs [was Structured Social Play] Adam Martin
- Casual vs. Hardcore gameplay Ian Collyer
- Casual vs. Hardcore gameplay Jon Lambert
- Higher barrier to entry? was NEWS: Blizzard Entertainment announces World of Warcraft Travis Nixon
- Higher barrier to entry? was NEWS: Blizzard En tertainment announces World of Warcraft Koster, Raph
- TECH: SEDA: An Architecture for Highly Concurrent Server Applications Bruce Mitchener
- Re:Play participants emails needed Marian Griffith
- [REALITY] [SOCIAL] ExistenZ Adam Martin
- [TECH] Mozilla as cross OS client for MUD/MMG ? Mathieu Castelli
- [TECH] Mozilla as cross OS client for MUD/MMG ? Chris Jones
- [TECH] Mozilla as cross OS client for MUD/MMG ? Par Winzell
- FW: [BIZ] Billing systems Dave Kennerly
- FW: Skotos TTT#44: The Global Community Christopher Allen
- [Fwd: Announce: New Mailing Lists Available] Bruce Mitchener
- BeQuest Michael Tresca
- Geometric content generation Matt Mihaly
- Geometric content generation Brian Hook
- Geometric content generation Matt Mihaly
- Geometric content generation Brian Hook
- Geometric content generation Derek Licciardi
- Geometric content generation Koster, Raph
- Geometric content generation Adam Martin
- Geometric content generation Daniel.Harman@barclayscapital.com
- Geometric content generation rayzam
- Geometric content generation Daniel.Harman@barclayscapital.com
- Geometric content generation Kwon Ekstrom
- Geometric content generation Daniel.Harman@barclayscapital.com
- Geometric content generation Brian Hook
- Geometric content generation Daniel.Harman@barclayscapital.com
- Geometric content generation Adam Martin
- Geometric content generation Daniel.Harman@barclayscapital.com
- Geometric content generation Koster, Raph
- Geometric content generation Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- Geometric content generation Koster, Raph
- Geometric content generation John Hopson
- Geometric content generation Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- Geometric content generation Dave Rickey
- Geometric content generation Daniel.Harman@barclayscapital.com
- Geometric content generation Dave Rickey
- Geometric content generation Vincent Archer
- Geometric content generation Daniel.Harman@barclayscapital.com
- Geometric content generation Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- Geometric content generation Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- Geometric content generation Dave Rickey
- Geometric content generation Adam Martin
- Geometric content generation rayzam
- Geometric content generation rayzam
- Geometric content generation Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- Geometric content generation J Aitken
- Geometric content generation Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- Geometric content generation Sasha Hart
- Geometric content generation rayzam
- Geometric content generation Adam Martin
- Geometric content generation J Aitken
- Geometric content generation rayzam
- Geometric content generation Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- Geometric content generation Dave Rickey
- Geometric content generation Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- Geometric content generation Dave Rickey
- Geometric content generation Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- Geometric content generation Matt Mihaly
- Geometric content generation Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- Geometric content generation Matt Mihaly
- Geometric content generation Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- Geometric content generation rayzam
- Geometric content generation Travis Nixon
- Geometric content generation Hans-Henrik Staerfeldt
- Geometric content generation Brian Hook
- Geometric content generation Hans-Henrik Staerfeldt
- Geometric content generation Brian Hook
- Geometric content generation Eli Stevens
- Geometric Content Generation John Robert Arras
- Geometric Content Generation Brian Hook
- Geometric content generation Hans-Henrik Staerfeldt
- Geometric content generation Brian Hook
- Geometric content generation Adam Martin
- Geometric content generation John Buehler
- Geometric content generation Hans-Henrik Staerfeldt
- Geometric content generation John Buehler
- Geometric content generation Hans-Henrik Staerfeldt
- Geometric content generation rayzam
- Geometric content generation Brian Hook
- Geometric content generation John Buehler
- Geometric content generation Daniel.Harman@barclayscapital.com
- Geometric content generation Brian Hook
- Geometric content generation Michael Tresca
- Geometric content generation Derek Licciardi
- Geometric content generation Brian Hook
- Geometric content generation Adam Martin
- Geometric content generation Brian Hook
- Geometric content generation Derek Licciardi
- Geometric content generation Robin Lee Powell
- Geometric content generation Kwon Ekstrom
- Geometric content generation Nathan F. Yospe
- Geometric content generation Travis Nixon
- Geometric content generation Nathan F. Yospe
- Geometric content generation Kwon Ekstrom
- Geometric content generation Travis Nixon
- Geometric content generation Nip
- Geometric content generation Jay Carlson
- Geometric content generation Kwon Ekstrom
- Geometric content generation John Buehler
- Geometric content generation J Todd Coleman
- Geometric content generation Peter Tyson
- Geometric content generation S. Patrick Gallaty
- Geometric content generation Eric Rhea
- Geometric content generation Paul Schwanz
- Geometric content generation Lee Sheldon
- Geometric content generation Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- Geometric content generation Lee Sheldon
- Geometric content generation Matt Mihaly
- Geometric content generation Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- Geometric content generation Matt Mihaly
- Geometric content generation Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- Geometric content generation Jon Lambert
- Geometric content generation Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- Geometric content generation Eric Rhea
- Geometric content generation Matt Mihaly
- Geometric content generation Eric Rhea
- Geometric content generation Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- Geometric content generation Koster, Raph
- Geometric content generation Brian Hook
- Geometric content generation Ian Collyer
- Geometric content generation John Buehler
- Geometric content generation Eli Stevens
- Geometric content generation Ian Collyer
- Geometric content generation John Buehler
- Geometric content generation gamaiun@yahoo.com
- Geometric content generation Derek Licciardi
- Geometric content generation Hans-Henrik Staerfeldt
- Geometric content generation Koster, Raph
- Geometric content generation Matt Mihaly
- Geometric content generation Hans-Henrik Staerfeldt
- Geometric content generation Kwon Ekstrom
- [DSN]Geometric content generation[LONG] Derek Licciardi
- [DSN]Geometric content generation[LONG] Matt Mihaly
- LTM article Trump
This was posted on Lumthemad.net I thought it might be of interest
to everyone here, I'm sure I'm not the only one who was both amused
and apalled by this.
A few comments.
1) The first time I thought of the idea of a 3D massively
multiplayer online RPG/empire building PVP game was in the mid
80's when I was playing with my brand new copy of SSI's Fantasy
Empires. Thought process went as follows: Hey, this would be cool
to play agaisnt other peolple over a big network. What if you
could play it like an RPG until the point where you built up
enough resources to start a fledgling empire. Or you could just
keep playing as an RPG if you wanted too. In empire mode you
could look top down at the map, in RPG mode it could be like DOOM.
That would be neat. Maybe you could even lead your own armies
like with AD&D's Battlesystem(TM).
I'm not going to demand royalties for you using my idea, because
I'm sure there were 100s of people who thought of it before I did.
The lines between Strategy and RPG game are already blurred by
games like Birthright and Heros of Might and Magic. Making a
MMORPG with strategy elements is not innovation, it is evolution.
Shadowbane is only the first to announce this AND have a serious
chance to making it to market.
2) Thinking of PvP as a niche concept really shows a total denial
of history. Many of the early graphical MUDs like NWN, DSO, M59,
Yserbious, etc had PvP, as well as many muds. In games where you
could get to max level quickly and there was little content PvP
was the only thing that kept these games from being chatrooms.
Many NWN veterans still cant be convinced that you can have an
endgame without PvP.
There were many people who thought there was no way EQ could work
becasue there was no PvP. How do you keep the players happy
without constantly bumping up the level cap and adding more and
more content? Well, that's exactly what they've had to do. They
are already on the 3rd major expansion pack.
Implying that Mythic is encroaching on YOUR niche pure comedy. Darkness
Falls (MUD from Mythic) + Magestorm (Team based 3D PvP game from Mythic) +
current technology = DaoC
Entire text of original article follows.
--<cut>--
And now, a rant from Todd "Warden" Coleman, a Shadowbane dev, on
searching for the PvP niche in second generation MMOGs.
------
Okay, now, I know that, in the past, we at Wolfpack have had a
tendency to leap at shadows and think that every idea that comes
down the pipe was "ours first." And yes, we might have been a bit
snaphappy to assume that (1) we're always first to come up with a
good idea, and (2) other people had to TAKE the idea from us, they
couldn't possibly have come up with it on their own. Paranoid?
Yeah, we are. Guilty as charge. And, looking back, I'm more than
happy to admit that the use of the EQ word "disciplines" had nothing
to do with SB. Nor was DAoC's "rock troll" lifted from our "stone
dwarves" -- these are smart teams with innovative ideas drawing from
the same knowledge base (ie mythology) and it's a compliment to all
of us that we see as many design intersections as we do.
That said, not everything in this industry is can necessarily be
chalked up to innocent coicidence. Sometimes even our staunchest
critics may occasionally blink their eyes, grin, and say, "well,
yeah, okay, maybe we'll give this one to you."
http://www.bluesnews.com/cgi-bin/articles.pl?show6
Coincidence? Maybe. It would be kind of hard for Codemasters to
claim they *didn't* know about SB, especially since I met with them
back in Sept of 99 in London when we first went looking for a
publisher.
My favorite line from the press release:
"Dragon Empires breaks the mould with the importance of player to
player combat to the game - it's open season on all the other
players all the time - and introduces the concept of player clans
ruling sprawling cities within the game's world."
Oh come on, now -- If you want to claim to do it, that's one
thing... but to claim to _introduce the concept_? Two years later?
Like I said, maybe it is innocent. Hell, it might not have anything
to do with us at all; they might have gotten the concept from these
guys. Anyway, though, I digress. The real question I wanted to ask
was, regardless of where the ideas come from.. why all the sudden
interest in PvP? As many of your readers are so quick to point out,
PvP isn't exactly the "most popular" feature of EQ, UO or AC. I
love engaging PvP combat myself. I think it provides a really good
sense of realism and hightened competition... but I also recognize
that I'm part of a niche market segment. When we set out to create
Shadowbane, we decided to specifically target a niche group of
players who weren't being given an offering suited to their tastes;
to provide interesting strategic and tactical combat to a market
segment that wasn't being satisfied by the existing "big three"
titles. Our secondary goal was, in choosing a niche, to remain
under the other games' radars by targeting a small enough player
base that they wouldn't bother to try and compete with us on a
feature-by-feature basis. This might have worked, btw -- except that
SB picked up a lot more marketing momentum then we ever expected
(especially with the cancellation of UO2 and AD&D online, something
we certainly never saw coming.)
So.. why is it now that everyone is flocking to our niche? Doesn't
that kind of fly in the face of the entire "niche marketing"
concept? I mean, a PvP-centered MMOG is good idea, but it's hardly
the ONLY idea out there. Hell, if I started a new game today I
might well concentrate 100% on tradeskills and economy. Why?
Because no one else is doing it! How did we go from "no one cares
about the PvPers, in fact let's ban em all!" to _everyone_ competing
for the same (completely unknown!) cache of PvP dollars -- in spite
of the fact that no one is positive that the PvP market can support
one good title, much less half a dozen. Now it seems like no one is
concentrating on the trade skills and cooperative play; what the
hell is up with that? It's the proven market! Hell, Shadowbane
looks to have a much stronger economic model than most of these new
offerings, and that was supposed to be our weak spot.
I swear I don't understand this industry some times. I don't buy
the idea that the right way to make money is to repeat the same
ideas over and over and over until everyone is blue in the face. I
always thought, as an entertainment medium, we were supposed to walk
that fine line between art & business -- too much art and you
produce something unplayable (quick *nod* to jess on that one), but
too much business and you end up with a bookcase full of
undistiguishable Quake clones.
1. Look at the Market. (What offerings are out there?)
2. Find an interesting area that no one else is doing. (What
customers aren't being satisfied?)
3. Innovate (What unique features/services/support can I offer
these specific customers?)
4. Deliver (Follow through with a quality product, quality
service, and quality support)
Step four is supposed to be the hard one, folks. Comparitively
speaking, one through three are a walk in the park.
Warden, Wolfpack
--<cut>-- - LTM article Travis Nixon
- LTM article J Todd Coleman
- LTM article Travis Nixon
- LTM article Matt Mihaly
- LTM article Sellers, Mike
- LTM article J Todd Coleman
- LTM article Daniel.Harman@barclayscapital.com
- LTM article Adam Martin
- LTM article Steve {Bloo} Daniels
- MMORPG Construction Kit Redux Lee Sheldon
- Request for ideas Eli Stevens
- Request for ideas J C Lawrence
- Request for ideas Jon Leonard
- Request for ideas Eli Stevens
- Request for ideas Timothy Dang
- Request for ideas Hans-Henrik Staerfeldt
- Request for ideas Dickinson, Dallas
- Request for ideas Matt Mihaly
- Request for ideas Bruce Mitchener
- Request for ideas Adam Martin
- Request for ideas Jon Leonard
- Request for ideas Jon Leonard
- Request for ideas Vincent Archer
- Request for ideas Matt Mihaly
- Request for ideas holding99@mindspring.com
- Request for ideas Freeman, Jeff
- Request for ideas Robin Lee Powell
- Request for ideas Andrew Hefford {Coregen}
- Request for ideas Koster, Raph
- Request for ideas John Buehler
- Request for ideas Christopher Allen
- Request for ideas Chuk Radder
- Request for ideas Nicolai Hansen
- Request for ideas Ben Chambers
- Request for ideas Marian Griffith
- Request for ideas Hans-Henrik Staerfeldt
- Request for ideas Ian Collyer
- Request for ideas Freeman, Jeff
- Request for ideas holding99@mindspring.com
- Request for ideas Patrick Dughi
- Request for ideas Christopher Allen
- Request for ideas Adam Martin
- Request for ideas Matt Mihaly
- Request for ideas Leland Hulbert II
- Request for ideas Travis Nixon
- Request for ideas Marian Griffith
- Request for ideas Ben Chambers
- Request for ideas Derek Licciardi
- Request for ideas John Buehler
- Spoofs Eli Stevens
- research in online games Manuel Oliveira
- research in online games Travis Nixon
- How Many Developers Does It take to Screw in a Lightbulb? [Poll] Lee Sheldon
- in-game vs web-based boards (was: Geometric content generation) Bruce Mitchener
- in-game vs web-based boards (was: Geometric content generation) Koster, Raph
- in-game vs web-based boards (was: Geometric content generation) Vincent Archer
- in-game vs web-based boards (was: Geometric content generation) Bruce Mitchener
- in-game vs web-based boards (was: Geometric content generation) Robin Lee Powell
- in-game vs web-based boards (was: Geometric content generation) Daniel.Harman@barclayscapital.com
- in-game vs web-based boards (was: Geometric content generation) John Buehler
- in-game vs web-based boards (was: Geometric content generation) Daniel.Harman@barclayscapital.com
- in-game vs web-based boards (was: Geometric content generation) Koster, Raph
- in-game vs web-based boards (was: Geometric content generation) John Buehler
- in-game vs web-based boards (was: Geometric content generation) Bruce Mitchener
- in-game vs web-based boards (was: Geometric content generation) Daniel.Harman@barclayscapital.com
- in-game vs web-based boards (was: Geometric content generation) Steve {Bloo} Daniels
- in-game vs web-based boards (was: Geometric content generation) Daniel.Harman@barclayscapital.com
- in-game vs web-based boards (was: Geometric contentgeneration) Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- in-game vs web-based boards (was: Geometric content generation) Travis Nixon
- in-game vs web-based boards (was: Geometric content generation) Daniel.Harman@barclayscapital.com
- Fwd: [CLIENT-DEV] Software Packages for MOO Bruce Mitchener
- Portable Class C Christopher Allen
- Portable Class C Vincent Archer
- [Meta] Portable Class C Dominic J. Eidson
- RP in EQ? Matt Mihaly
- AO Mess Vincent Archer
- Lum the Mad is closing Valerio Santinelli
- Historic lessons on fluid identity Marian Griffith
- Historic lessons on fluid identity Matt Mihaly
- Historic lessons on fluid identity Marian Griffith
- Historic lessons on fluid identity Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- Historic lessons on fluid identity Matt Mihaly
- Historic lessons on fluid identity Marian Griffith
- Historic lessons on fluid identity Marc Bowden
- Historic lessons on fluid identity Jon Lambert
- Historic lessons on fluid identity John Buehler
- Historic lessons on fluid identity David Lindsey
- Historic lessons on fluid identity Matt Mihaly
- Lum the Mad is closing--sort of Koster, Raph