September 1999
- Battle Systems Philip Loguinov -- Draymoor
- Battle Systems Matthew Mihaly
- Battle Systems Richard Woolcock
- Battle Systems Matthew Mihaly
- Battle Systems Richard Woolcock
- Battle Systems Mik Clarke
- Battle Systems Greg Miller
- Battle Systems Ben Greear
- Battle Systems Matthew Mihaly
- Battle Systems Greg Miller
- Battle Systems Christopher Allen
- Battle Systems Batis
- Battle Systems Hans-Henrik Staerfeldt
- Battle Systems Richard Ross
- Battle Systems Matthew Mihaly
- semi-OT: Alan Cox is a MUD hacker Adam Wiggins
- semi-OT: Alan Cox is a MUD hacker Ben Greear
- Graphical Mud Design JT Herring
- Graphical Mud Design Chris Gray
- Graphical Mud Design David
- ScryMUD is offically open to the public. Ben Greear
- ScryMUD is offically open to the public. Chris Gray
- ScryMUD is offically open to the public. Ben Greear
- ScryMUD is offically open to the public. Ben Greear
- IMP (Interactive Mud Protocol?) Philip Loguinov -- Draymoor
- IMP (Interactive Mud Protocol?) J C Lawrence
- Its not a MUD...is it? J C Lawrence
- An Introduction Hess, Ian {Ian} *CTR*
- An Introduction Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- An Introduction Mik Clarke
- An Introduction Greg Miller
- An Introduction Ilya, SCC, Game Commando
- An Introduction Matthew Mihaly
- An Introduction Jeremy Music "Sterling"
- An Introduction Matthew Mihaly
- An Introduction Jeremy Music "Sterling"
- An Introduction Hess, Ian {Ian} *CTR*
- An Introduction Wes Connell
- An Introduction Greg Miller
- An Introduction Albert
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Tony Wilkinson
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Jeremy Music "Sterling"
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Greg Miller
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Marc Bowden
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Sellers, Michael
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Tony Wilkinson
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Matthew Mihaly
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Ilya, SCC, Game Commando
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Matthew Mihaly
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Jon A. Lambert
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Matthew Mihaly
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Travis Casey
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Wes Connell
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Adam Wiggins
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Dundee
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Matthew Mihaly
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Dundee
On Thu, 9 Sep 1999 16:56:16 -0700 (PDT), Matthew Mihaly <diablo@best.com>
wrote:
> > On Thu, 9 Sep 1999 02:31:25 -0400, Travis Casey <efindel@io.com> wrote:
> >
> > > It is possible to do player-vs-player scenarios in table-top RPGs; I've
> > > run them before. There are published adventures built around p-v-p
> > PKing doesn't exist outside of MUD'dom. If you get PK'd in the ol' weekly
> > tabletop D&D game, then someone doesn't come back next week - either the PK
> > or you.
> I'm not really sure I follow your logic. We're talking about PK in muds,
I was responding to "It is possible to do player-vs-player scenarios in
table-top RPGs; ".
Basically just to say, That Isn't PKing.
And by PKing I mean only, "non-consensual pvp combat".
Generally I see people use "PvP" to mean consensual combat, and "PK" to
mean non-consensual combat. But by all means, if you have a problem with
those terms, I'll write out the long version each time.
> not table top games (where, as you point out, it doesn't really happen).
> I, personally, don't like any distinction made between consensual and
> non-consensual PK,
Well, there is a distinction whether you like it or not. Consensual combat
is great fun for both parties. Non-consensual combat is not.
Also, non-consensual combat will get you kicked off my mud. Consensual
combat is fine-n-dandy.
Hard to believe we can make that distinction if such a distinction doesn't
exist...
> PvP is player vs. player. It does not in any way imply combat, though it very well may
> include combat) simply does not allow players to experience the same range
> of emotions that real PK does.
Likewise, going to a paintball game and shooting other paintball players
doesn't allow for the same range of emotions as, say, going to the mall and
shooting people with my paintball gun. You should see how emotional they
get. The mall should thank me for making their shopping experience
non-boring.
Oddly enough, though, they just don't appreciate what a good pk can do for
an otherwise boring mall.
> of course this heightens emotions, but nothing gets emotions going as well
> as being PK'd or generally messed with unintentionally.
Oh it's intentional, but I think you mean "without the victims consent".
Undoubtedly, that'll spark some emotion. Not any good emotions, but what
the heck, eh?
And in any case, it still says nothing about the sorts of people who have
fun at other people expense. If you think it's great fun to be mean to
people, then there *is* something wrong with you.
They aren't the sorts of people that I want to hang with, nor subject my
other users to. If I just wanted to jack with my players then I'd wander
around and kill them willy nilly myself, zero-out their hard-earned skills,
take their kewl lewt, etc. That'd really make their blood boil.
Some sort of war could be fun: structured PvP combat. But random mugging
is just worthless. It's impossible to have any amount of it without the
entire game revolving around it. And if you *want* your entire game to
revolve around it, then that's fine too... but then there's nothing
non-consensual about the combat there then, since everyone knew that's what
the whole MUD was all about when they logged in.
People get disgusted with PKers when they login to a MUD that *claims* it
isn't all about PKing, that there's more to it than that, and then it turns
out that, no, it's all about PKing after all. Also invariably, if
unrestricted PKing is allowed, then it's all about PKing.
Well, except the PKs like that sort of environment. Target-rich, I think
they call it.
--
http://dundee.uong.com/ - The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Matthew Mihaly
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Adam Wiggins
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Matthew Mihaly
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Matthew Mihaly
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Adam Wiggins
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Matthew Mihaly
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Dundee
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Matthew Mihaly
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? J C Lawrence
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Chris Turner
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Jon A. Lambert
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Dundee
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Matthew Mihaly
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Asmodeus
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Dundee
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Matthew Mihaly
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- The Relationship between pkers andmonster AI? Mik Clarke
- The Relationship between pkers andmonster AI? Matthew Mihaly
- The Relationship between pkers andmonster AI? Sellers, Michael
- The Relationship between pkers andmonster AI? Matthew Mihaly
- The Relationship between pkers andmonster AI? J C Lawrence
- The Relationship between pkers andmonster AI? Matthew Mihaly
- The Relationship between pkers andmonster AI? Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- The Relationship between pkers andmonster AI? Matthew Mihaly
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Greg Miller
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Jon A. Lambert
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Jon A. Lambert
- The Relationship between pkers and monster A I? Sellers, Michael
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Mik Clarke
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Matthew Mihaly
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Jeremy Music "Sterling"
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Jon A. Lambert
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Matthew Mihaly
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Travis S. Casey
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Matthew Mihaly
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Sellers, Michael
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Zaid Sayeed
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Solmyr of the Azure Star
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Sellers, Michael
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Solmyr of the Azure Star
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Greg Miller
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Greg Miller
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Matthew Mihaly
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Adam Wiggins
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Greg Miller
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Laurel Fan
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Greg Miller
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Greg Miller
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Greg Miller
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Travis Casey
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Greg Miller
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Travis S. Casey
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Greg Miller
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Solmyr of the Azure Star
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Matthew Mihaly
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Adam Wiggins
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Matthew Mihaly
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Adam Wiggins
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Matthew Mihaly
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Solmyr of the Azure Star
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Sellers, Michael
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Solmyr of the Azure Star
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Matthew Mihaly
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Matthew Mihaly
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Greg Miller
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? JT Herring
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Matthew Mihaly
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Greg Miller
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Kylotan
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Greg Miller
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Mik Clarke
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Greg Miller
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Mik Clarke
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Matthew Mihaly
- The Relationship between pkers and monster AI? Adam Wiggins
- Skill Power vs Skill Rarity Philip Loguinov -- Draymoor
- Skill Power vs Skill Rarity Mik Clarke
- Consensual/PvP/PK Ilya, Game Commandos
- Announcement Locke / Mad Merv
- Announcement J C Lawrence
- Announcement Greg Miller
- Tactical Interest Was MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Spin
- Tactical Interest Was MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Travis S. Casey
- Tactical Interest Was MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Hans-Henrik Staerfeldt
- Tactical Interest Was MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Adam Wiggins
- Tactical Interest Was MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Ilya, Game Commandos
- Tactical Interest Was MUD-Dev digest, Vol 1 #142 - 4 msgs Mik Clarke
- Attracting players // TMC // 'admin' type reviewing Ilya, Game Commandos
- Attracting players // TMC // 'admin' type reviewing J C Lawrence
- Attracting players // TMC // 'admin' type reviewing Emil Eifrém
- Attracting players Koster, Raph
- Attracting players Dominic J. Eidson
- Attracting players Matthew Mihaly
- Attracting players John Hopson
- Attracting players David Bennett
- Attracting players Ilya, Game Commandos
- Attracting players Koster, Raph
- Attracting players The MUD Connector - Administrator
- Attracting players Dundee
- Attracting players Adam Wiggins
- Attracting players Matthew Mihaly
- Attracting players Koster, Raph
- Attracting players Adam Wiggins
- Attracting players Ilya, Game Commandos
- Attracting players Emil Eifrém
- Attracting players Mik Clarke
- Attracting players The MUD Connector - Administrator
- Attracting players Petri Virkkula
- Attracting players Koster, Raph
- Attracting players Matthew Mihaly
- Attracting players Koster, Raph
- Attracting players Matthew Mihaly
- Attracting players David Bennett
- Attracting players Greg Miller
- Attracting players Laurel Fan
- Attracting players Scatter
- Attracting players Andrew Wilson
- Attracting players Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- Attracting players Greg Miller
- Attracting players Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- Attracting players Greg Miller
- Attracting players Greg Miller
- Attracting players Matthew Mihaly
- attracting players Par Winzell
- attracting players David Bennett
- attracting players Mud Imp
- attracting players Marc Bowden
- attracting players adam@treyarch.com
- attracting players Kevin Scott London
- attracting players Ben Greear
- attracting players Wes Connell
- attracting players Marc Bowden
- attracting players Willowreed@aol.com
- attracting players Mordengaard
- attracting players adam@treyarch.com
- attracting players Jon A. Lambert
- attracting players David Bennett
- attracting players Marc Bowden
- Attracting players mrkelley@one.net
- Attracting players Louis
- Attracting players Matt Mihaly
- chess Matthew Mihaly
- chess Robin Cloutman
- an essay on PK Adam Wiggins
- an essay on PK J C Lawrence
- an essay on PK Marian Griffith
- an essay on PK Jeremy Music "Sterling"
- an essay on PK Chris Turner
- an essay on PK Adam Wiggins
- an essay on PK Chris Turner
- an essay on PK Adam Wiggins
- an essay on PK Charles Hughes
- an essay on PK Adam Wiggins
- an essay on PK Chris Turner
- an essay on PK Adam Wiggins
- an essay on PK Matthew Mihaly
- an essay on PK Jon A. Lambert
- an essay on PK Matthew Mihaly
- an essay on PK Ilya, Game Commandos
- an essay on PK Marian Griffith
- an essay on PK Matthew Mihaly
- an essay on PK Rhonda Alexander
- an essay on PK Ilya, Game Commandos
- an essay on PK Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- an essay on PK Laurel Fan
- an essay on PK Miroslav Silovic
- an essay on PK Matthew Mihaly
- an essay on PK Marian Griffith
- an essay on PK Matthew Mihaly
- an essay on PK Adam Wiggins
- an essay on PK J C Lawrence
- an essay on PK Richard Bartle
- an essay on PK Jason Spangler
- an essay on PK Willowreed@aol.com
- an essay on PK Koster, Raph
- an essay on PK Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- an essay on PK Richard Bartle
- Might not make right... Spin
- META: MUD-Dev visibility J C Lawrence
- Seeking one or two creative C coders for MURP project. Darin De Stefano
- Algorithms for an Infinite Universe Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- Algorithms for an Infinite Universe Quzah
- Algorithms for an Infinite Universe Jp Calderone
- Algorithms for an Infinite Universe Joel Kelso
- Algorithms for an Infinite Universe Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- Algorithms for an Infinite Universe Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- Dynamic muds ryan
- Dynamic muds Asmodeus
- Dynamic muds Robin Cloutman
- Dynamic muds ryan
- Dynamic muds Ilya, Game Commandos
- Dynamic muds Colin Coghill
- Dynamic muds J C Lawrence
- Dynamic muds Emil Eifrém
- Dynamic muds Katrina McClelan
- Dynamic muds Ilya, Game Commandos
- Dynamic muds David Bennett
- Dynamic muds Christopher Allen - GM Fangs
- Dynamic muds Spin
- Dynamic muds Ilya, Game Commandos
- Dynamic muds Spin
- Dynamic muds Chris Turner
- Dynamic muds Adam Wiggins
- Dynamic muds Mik Clarke
- Dynamic muds Arlie Stephens
- Dynamic muds Eli Stevens {KiZurich}
- Dynamic muds Greg Miller
- Dynamic muds Petri Virkkula
- Dynamic muds Ben Greear
- Dynamic muds Greg Miller
- Dynamic muds Colin Coghill
- Dynamic muds Katrina McClelan
- Dynamic muds Marian Griffith
- Dynamic muds Katrina McClelan
- Dynamic muds Alex Oren
- Dynamic muds Eli Stevens {KiZurich}
- Dynamic muds Chris Gray
- Dynamic muds Ronan Farrell
- Dynamic muds Petri Virkkula
- Dynamic muds Christopher Allen
- Dynamic muds Petri Virkkula
- Dynamic muds Justin Lockshaw
- Dynamic muds Mik Clarke
- Dynamic muds Marian Griffith
- Dynamic muds Travis S. Casey
- Dynamic muds Marian Griffith
- thoughts on 'realism' Matthew Mihaly
- Tactical Interest Spin
- Tactical Interest Spin
- Tactical Interest Adam Wiggins
- what players want, what I want Ilya, Game Commandos
- what players want, what I want Matthew Mihaly
- what players want, what I want Ilya, Game Commandos
- what players want, what I want Justin Lockshaw
- what players want, what I want Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- Creating a mudlib Solmyr of the Azure Star
- Mobiles AI and automation Crystalmir
- Mobiles AI and automation Matthew Mihaly
- Mobiles AI and automation Marc Bowden
- Mobiles AI and automation Mik Clarke
- This is just... STRANGE Dundee
- Mail delivery failed: returning message to sender (fwd) Matthew Mihaly
- Ultima Online Steve Sparks
- Ultima Online Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- Peer pressure and cooperation Miroslav Silovic
- Effiecient interaction (was deliver failed) Spin
- ADMIN: We're moving again J C Lawrence
- "Online migration and population mobility" Koster, Raph
- "Online migration and population mobility" Koster, Raph