May 1999
- Object server. Quzah [softhome]
- Censorship & Its Impact On World Immersion J C Lawrence
- OT: Ethics v Law Greg Munt
- Virtual v Artificial Worlds Greg Munt
- Virtual v Artificial Worlds Matthew Mihaly
- Custom Server Roll Call? Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- Custom Server Roll Call? Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- Custom Server Roll Call? Wes Connell
- Custom Server Roll Call? David Bennett
- Custom Server Roll Call? Koster, Raph
- Custom Server Roll Call? Greg Munt
- Custom Server Roll Call? The Arrow
- Custom Server Roll Call? Alex Stewart
- Custom Server Roll Call? Nathan F Yospe
- Custom Server Roll Call? Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- Custom Server Roll Call? Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- Custom Server Roll Call? Jon A. Lambert
On 5 May 99,, Ola Fosheim Grøstad wrote:
>
> Besides, in general copyright only applies if you actually looked at their
> product while you created your own design doc. AFAIK you can have >
someone
> make an abstract description of the ideas contained in AD&D while looking at
> them, then hand it to a cleanroom team which make a design and implement it.
No, this is most definitely not so. This above is peculiar to software
and some other processes.
> This is to get a good case in court. For hobbyists I guess that means
> sitting in a room stripped for other writings over a weekend writing down
> the basic design doc, make some copies and have everybody sign a date
> stamped confirmation that it is not based on other designs and that other
> designs were not available to those who wrote the design doc. (I'm not a
> lawyer) The standard hobbyist evolutionary approach is however a bit more
> tricky to defend legally I guess... :(
I would disagree here. Game systems cannot be copyrighted. This is an
old argument, one where there is much legal precedent (U.S. that is) with
cases involving Milton Bradley and Parker Brothers. They whole area of
boardgames contains examples of game systems which are exact clones
of other boardgame systems. They only protection available is by
patenting. The best current example of a game system protected in this
manner is Wizards Of The Coast's "Magic the Gathering" and it's licensed
descendants. TSR's (now WOTC's) AD&D system was never patented. TSR did
at one point, sue a number of companies that produced adventures, modules
and rules extensions for D&D and AD&D with NO success. I repeat NO
success. Judge's Guild and Gamelords for instance.
I think you will find some discussion of it in the very early archives.
Jeff Kesselman maintained a quite a lengthy file on the finer legal
aspects of the TSR feud. I can't remember the FTP sites it was on, but
you may find it through a web search.
In a nutshell, TSR claimed that their Dungeon Master's Guide and Player
Handbook were literary works and not Game Rules or works of reference.
This was never legally tested against muds in particular, yet there was
enough posturing backed with impressive letters from corporate lawyers to
frighten off many a sysadmin or ISP. OTOH, TSR's position on using
literary material from their Forgotten Realms and other modules and
novels is quite valid. Also, significant quoting or wholesale copying
from the rulebooks is not legal. The problem peculiar to role-playing
games is the intertwining mixture of copyrightable and creative literary
material (which includes written rules and descriptions) with the game
system.
BTW, does anyone remember Sojourn's lengthy logon statement directed at
TSR. TSR failed to shut Sojourn down.
There is an older company, Avalon Hill, that has taken a very solid and
supportable legal position on one of their games. There are several
"Diplomacy" servers that are running on the net which implement the game
rules exactly. And even implement "unauthorized" variations. These
servers never quote the rules and have no help files regarding the rules
of the game, they merely implement the game system itself. Anyone
wanting to know the rules must resort to purchasing the game. It's a
good model to follow.
The legal bottom line is this. I can implement an AD&D, Rolemaster,
CyberPunk, Warhammer or Vampyre: The Masquerade systems EXACTLY. The key
word here is SYSTEM. I can use the words Armor Class, Hit points, etc.
along with the concepts. I can use spells named Prismatic Spray,
creatures like Halflings and Drow Elves. I cannot QUOTE from the rules,
nor can I use literal descriptions of spells and monsters culled from
their books. TSR's claims to many of it's "unique" spell names and
creature names were laughable in any event, since 90% of them can be
traced to popular novels and mythology. Now I cannot use trademarked
names like World of Krynn or character names culled from TSRs literary
works.
OTOH, The practical bottom line is this: If you receive a letter from a
big corporate lawyer, immediately comply with whatever the hell they
want, or be prepared to play the game of legal bluff and blunder, and
accept the consequences, unjust though they may be.
Sorry this is probably off-topic.
--
--* Jon A. Lambert - TychoMUD Email:jlsysinc@.ix.netcom.com *--
--* Mud Server Developer's Page <http://pw1.netcom.com/~jlsysinc> *--
--* I am the Dragon of Grindly Grund, but my lunches aren't very much fun, *--
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- Interesting dilemma Peck, Matthew x96724c1
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- Interesting dilemma Quzah [softhome]
- Interesting dilemma Brandon A Downey
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- Interesting dilemma Benjamin D. Wiechel
- Interesting dilemma Koster, Raph
- Interesting dilemma Wes Connell
- Interesting dilemma Mattias Lönnqvist
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- AW: Interesting dilemma Hofbauer Heinz
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- Virtual Property Koster, Raph
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- Discussion of large server IO handling desing J C Lawrence
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- Planes of existance Greg Munt
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- old fight system I toyed with Koster, Raph
- APE 0.2.1 J C Lawrence
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- Time Discontinuous MUD Ling
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- Semi-OT: International intellectual property rights Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- Marc Hernandez' Server Greg Munt
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- Marc Hernandez' Server qitelremel@hotmail.com
- Scry 1.9.1 (Feature Freeze) released. Ben Greear
- The distinction between magic spells and magic abilities Greg Munt
- The distinction between magic spells and magic abilities Matthew Mihaly
- Multi-threaded mud server. Ross Nicoll
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- Kanga.Nu has finally moved... claw@kanga.nu
- Java & MUD servers Laurent Bossavit
- ScryMUD 1.9.3 released. Ben Greear
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- [TECHNICAL] How to generate pre-processor output (template problem). Ben Greear
- Searching the archives claw@kanga.nu
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- [RELEASE] ScryMUD 1.9.4 available for download. Ben Greear