January 1999
- From DevMud: Database module Greg Connor
- From DevMud: Database module Mik Clarke
- From DevMud: Database module Greg Connor
- From DevMud: Database module J C Lawrence
- From DevMud: Database module Greg Connor
- ADMIN: Resends and possible duplicates J C Lawrence
- Info about different skill systems Emil Eifrem
- Info about different skill systems Nathan F Yospe
- Info about different skill systems Ben Greear
- Info about different skill systems Emil Eifrem
- Info about different skill systems Ben Greear
- Info about different skill systems Emil Eifrem
- Info about different skill systems Nathan F Yospe
- Info about different skill systems Travis S. Casey
- Info about different skill systems Mik Clarke
- New features for ScryMUD (Player-run Shops) Ben Greear
- [OT Humor] Mudder's Rhapsody Jon A. Lambert
- [OT Humor] Mudder's Rhapsody Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- [OT Humor] Mudder's Rhapsody The Wildman
- Guild/skill/spell relation (or "webs") Petri Virkkula
- Guild/skill/spell relation (or "webs") David Bennett
- mobile movement Matthew Mihaly
- mobile movement Adam Wiggins
- mobile movement Koster, Raph
- mobile movement Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- mobile movement David Bennett
- mobile movement Kylotan
- mobile movement quzah [softhome]
- mobile movement Ling
- mobile movement J C Lawrence
- mobile movement Oliver Jowett
- mobile movement Oliver Jowett
- mobile movement Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- mobile movement Richard Woolcock
- mobile movement J C Lawrence
- mobile movement Ling
- mobile movement Marc Hernandez
- mobile movement J C Lawrence
- mobile movement Ling
- mobile movement Holly Sommer
- mobile movement Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- mobile movement Koster, Raph
- mobile movement Chris Gray
- Intelligent WebGlimpse archive searching at Kanga.Nu (was J C Lawrence
- [RRE]MediaMOO annual birthday symposia: 1/20 Bruce Mitchener, Jr.
- [RRE]MediaMOO annual birthday symposia: 1/20 Koster, Raph
- OT: Mike Sellers needs some help load testing J C Lawrence
- Keegan's MUD Tree J C Lawrence
- Intelligent WebGlimpse archive searching at Kanga.Nu Marian Griffith
- Intelligent WebGlimpse archive searching at Kanga.Nu Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- Intelligent WebGlimpse archive searching at Kanga.Nu Dominic J. Eidson
- Intelligent WebGlimpse archive searching at Kanga.Nu J C Lawrence
- Intelligent WebGlimpse archive searching at Kanga.Nu Marian Griffith
- GRASS GIS Web Site Elis Pomales
- Thoughts Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- mobile movement (the fault of tracking) quzah [softhome]
- ADMIN Name server problems and upes J C Lawrence
- Adjective Server Christopher Allen
- Reputations, More Mazes Eli Stevens {KiZurich}
- Reputations, More Mazes J C Lawrence
On Fri, 15 Jan 1999 04:05:09 -0600
KiZurich <Eli> wrote:
> J. C. Lawrence:
>> At the danger of treading into meta territory, considering MUD-Dev
>> as a MUD, what of the same danger and problem with the more
>> established (well known, reputations, etc) posters in MUD-Dev, or
>> even of myself here? There is a definate peerage (nod to Lambert)
>> in the older posters in MUD-Dev. I find it worrisome. It also
>> acts as a significant barrier to entry for new posters.
> After I read this, I noticed that I have had ideas that I have not
> posted because I questioned the signal to noise ratio.
??? You questioned the signal to noise ratio of the list, or of your
ability to contribute to the list? Ouch.
> Quite frankly, the list can be rather intimidating...
Aye, you're unfortunately not the first to say so. This is something
that needs to change. The list will not survive, and more importantly
will not serve the purpose I intend for it if it degrades into an
ivory tower forum for assumed masters.
> ...for a sophomore in college with a scant four years (mostly self
> taught) of programming experience.
FWVLIW I have no formal education in the field, or in computing for
that matter (am self taught the whole way), have spent just under half
of my working life doing things not computer or game related (aquarium
fish breeding, cat breeding, commercial fisherman, printer, school
teacher SF&F writer etc), and now make my living as a contractor,
moving from client to client as the programming need takes me (as
happens I'm looking for my next contract now; the one at SGI is about
up). The *only* claim to fame I have in the area (MUDs or
programming) is that I have worked hard to be able to understand and
create "interesting things" in those areas, and a certain ability to
bullshit people, no more. This gives me no advantage or altitude over
you or the rest of the list, just a different viewpoint.
> In any case, I have a bit more to add to the subject of mazes...
Excellant.
> Quzah's thread on the "maze of the mind" system got me thinking on a
> better way to model vast, twisting, untamed wilderness without
> having to store thousands of rarely visited rooms (much less code
> them).
> My first thought was to randomly generate them. But, it seems to me
> that forests should be more static than that, trees and boulders do
> not jump around that much. Instead, the descriptions, exits, etc.
> could be generated from a known seed value for a random number
> generator set aside for the mazes.
Quite. Well analysed.
> To sum up: Random number generator that can be seeded easily (1)
> Mad-libs style room descriptor (1) (There is a [pick size] [pick
> type] tree in front of you. The forest floor is littered with [pick
> ground cover].) Reversable bit masher used when party travels (1
> per movement axis allowed)
In principle this is good stuff (and well workable). The problem is
translating it to a workable, interesting and believable environment
within the game world. Nobody here has yet done that, tho we have all
nodded out heads wisely and said, "Yes, that's a good system that
would work well in principle." Implementation is a whole other bitch:
Okay, you have a random value. Exactly how do you translate that
into a generated room which is fairly consistent with the rooms
surrounding it (encluding those NE/NW/SE/SW), or is at least
believable without being a very simple variation of combinations of a
few components in a room:
Tree? Yes/No
Rock? Yes/No
Pond? Yes/No
etc.
Simple random combinations of the above makes for a mighty boring
area.
Possible approach:
Devise a compressed (ie light storage requirements) meta form of the
area you wish to describe. This might be a two (or three) dimensional
array of integers, each teated as a bitfield or compressed record,
with each integer mapping to a single room/location. The values in
each integer would name the basic characteristics of that location,
landmarks, etc but at a very compressed level. The random seed (and
its variations if needed) are then used to provide localised
customisation (ie non-architectural items), on top of the basic
framework laid out by the meta-data.
> That, and it's way past my bedtime. :)
Ahh.
--
J C Lawrence Internet: claw@kanga.nu
----------(*) Internet: coder@kanga.nu
...Honorary Member of Clan McFud -- Teamer's Avenging Monolith... - Reputations, More Mazes Eli Stevens {KiZurich}
- Reputations, More Mazes J C Lawrence
- Mules (was something different) Marian Griffith
- Mules (was something different) J C Lawrence
- Mules (was something different) Hans-Henrik Staerfeldt
- Levels versus Skills Marian Griffith
- Levels versus Skills Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- Levels versus Skills J C Lawrence
- Levels versus Skills quzah [softhome]
- Levels versus Skills Vladimir Prelovac
- Levels versus Skills quzah [softhome]
- Levels versus Skills J C Lawrence
- Levels versus Skills Petri Virkkula
- Levels versus Skills J C Lawrence
- Levels versus Skills Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- From Devmud: Database module, draft 3 Greg Connor
- Matrix Game Ling
- Graphic design doc Thinus Barnard
- Graphic design doc Chris Gray
- ADMIN: List server and Kanga.Nu host changes J C Lawrence
- ADMIN: List server and Kanga.Nu host changes Koster, Raph
- Sockets and fibers Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- Sockets and fibers Adam J. Thornton
- Sockets and fibers Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- Sockets and fibers J C Lawrence
- Sockets and fibers Jon A. Lambert
- Sockets and fibers Adam J. Thornton
- Sockets and fibers Dr. Cat
- Sockets and fibers Jo Dillon
- [DevMUD] From Devmud: Database module, draft 3 Greg Connor
- META: list "peerage" Koster, Raph
- META: list "peerage" John Bertoglio
- META: list "peerage" diablo@best.com
- META: list "peerage" Andy Cink
- META: list "peerage" Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- META: list "peerage" Quzah [softhome]
- META: list "peerage" Michael.Willey@abnamro.com
- META: list "peerage" Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- META: list "peerage" Holly Sommer
- META: list "peerage" Travis S. Casey
- META: list "peerage" Andy Cink
- META: list "peerage" Quzah [softhome]
- META: list "peerage" Matthew D. Fuller
- META: list "peerage" Laurel Fan
- META: list "peerage" Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- META: list "peerage" David Bennett
- META: list "peerage" Bruce Mitchener, Jr.
- META: list "peerage" diablo@best.com
- META: list "peerage" Matthew D. Fuller
- META: list "peerage" Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- META: list "peerage" Brandon A Downey
- META: list "peerage" Travis Casey
- META: list "peerage" Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- META: list "peerage" Dominic J. Eidson
- META: List "peerage" Marian Griffith
- META: List "peerage" Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- META: list "peerage" Ola Fosheim Grøstad
- META: list "peerage" Sayeed
- Mugu Chris Gray
- META: List peerage and behaviour J C Lawrence
- META: list "peerage" Chris Gray
- ADMIN: We're working again. J C Lawrence
- Java I/O and threads. Elis Pomales
- Java I/O and threads. Jo Dillon
- Java I/O and threads. cynbe@muq.org
- Java I/O and threads. Jo Dillon
- Java I/O and threads. Elis Pomales
- Reset Death Wes Connell
- Reset Death Quzah [softhome]
- Reset Death Wes Connell
- Reset Death Mik Clarke
- Reset Death Andrew C.M. McClintock
- Reset Death Mik Clarke
- PvP and mob capacities (was "List Peerage") Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- combat diablo@best.com
- META: list "peerage" Darrin Hyrup
- META: list "peerage" J C Lawrence
- Telmaron and Mud servers was: META: list "peerage" Elis Pomales
- META: list "peerage" Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- META: list "peerage" Ben Greear
- Who is? (was about level vs skills) Marian Griffith
- Who is? (was about level vs skills) Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- exploration points diablo@best.com
- [MUD-Dev] Juha Lindfors
- Stock Mud Demographics ##Make Nylander
- ADMIN: Off-topic and the ever present reminders on quoting. J C Lawrence
- Mud reviewing Andy Cink
- Mud reviewing Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- Mud reviewing diablo@best.com
- Mud reviewing Andru Luvisi
- Mud reviewing diablo@best.com
- Mud reviewing J C Lawrence
- Mud reviewing Dan Shiovitz
- Mud reviewing diablo@best.com
- Mud reviewing Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- Mud reviewing diablo@best.com
- Mud reviewing Richard Woolcock
- Mud reviewing David Bennett
- Mud reviewing Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- MUD Admin skills Hal Black
- Subdue Holly Sommer
- processors diablo@best.com
- processors John Bertoglio
- processors Wes Connell
- processors Laurel Fan
- processors Mik Clarke
- processors J C Lawrence
- processors diablo@best.com
- processors Quzah [softhome]
- processors Mik Clarke
- processors J C Lawrence
- processors Marc Hernandez
- processors Adam Wiggins
- processors Greg Underwood
- processors Adam Wiggins
- processors Chris Gray
- processors gunderwood@donet.com
- processors Jon A. Lambert
- processors Greg Underwood
- processors Petri Virkkula
- quests involving players diablo@best.com
- quests involving players Darren Henderson
- quests involving players Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- quests involving players Richard Woolcock