June 1998
- Playerkilling website Koster, Raph
- Playerkilling website John Bertoglio
- Playerkilling website Koster, Raph
- Playerkilling website J C Lawrence
- Playerkilling website J C Lawrence
On Mon, 1 Jun 1998 17:35:16 -0500
Koster, Raph<rkoster@origin.ea.com> wrote:
> Very interesting site here. Check out the interviews/poll part.
> http://www.pk-hq.com/
Fascinating! Especially the anti-PK side...
From <URL:http://www.pk-hq.com/apk-hq/news/news.htm>:
--<cut>--
EQ vault Pk editorial
Player killing is one of the most talked about aspects of Everquest,
and the debate over whether you should or shouldn't, whether it's fair
or not, and the character and age of the people who do or not player
kill seems to rekindle itself every other day. Everquest provides
something that Ultima Online does not - a chance to decide whether you
are able to kill and be killed by others, and this PvP "switch" is
also fuel for vigorous debate. Allowing both options provides us with
an opportunity to play Everquest the way we want to, with others
facing challenges they *opt* to face.
MUDs have had this "switch" for almost a decade. The typical MUD has
the player decide upon character creation whether they wish to be able
to kill and be killed by players. Some MUDs will further restrict
player killing with a level block, such as being limited to fighting
against players 5 levels or less different, or by allowing player
killing only after a certain level has been obtained. Players who aid
PvP players usually are forced to become PvP characters themselves, to
maintain a level playing field. You can often switch from non PvP to
PvP, but never back.
Everquest's "switch" is not a toggle, it is a selected characteristic
of your character at creation. If you want to have the thrill of
logging in and having to be wary of foes at all times, the opportunity
to boast of your skills, or the challenge of outwitting a real enemy,
as opposed to a computer one, you can decide at creation. Like many
MUDs, Everquest also allows you to change your PvP orientation from
Non-PvP to PvP, but going back is difficult, if not impossible. This
is a very important feature, and subject to a lot of debate, since it
seems to allow players to "beef" up their characters as non-PvP, then
switch and go on a rampage when their character is strong enough.
It does. Those who wish to do that are welcome to, and probably
should. Is this unfair? No, not really, since everyone has the choice
to do it or not do it. You have that choice. I would tend to say that
"Pure" PvP could use other characters' PvP change to give them a
really hard time, call them weak, and claim that they were not "true"
PvP. I'm all for that. An important point is that once you go PvP you
can't go back. This stops someone from helping a PvP friend obtain
revenge, and then switch back to avoid retaliation. One thing I will
note is that those who start as PvP will have a big advantage over
"switchers", because the skills, abilities, and mindset needed to
succeed as non PvP might be different than those of a PvP player. I
once played a MUD where PvP players used to love newbie PvP's who
thought they knew everything, and give them a quick dose of 4 or 5
different ways to die. They learned, eventually.
For those who wish to not PvP, it gives breathing room to allow for
more social interaction, exploration, and role-playing
opportunities. I remember seeing the picture sequence of Pl8tDewd and
Bon3d00d, with the hilarious encounter between two hardened PKs and a
"role-player". While I laughed at the scene, I also remembered that
the role-player had taken obvious pains to dress her character as she
wished, with careful attention to her presentation when she interacted
with the Doods, and felt a little sad. The world needs the creativity
and color offered by such a player, and it takes the wind out of such
a player when hours of work is callously destroyed. Not everyone has
30 hours online a week, and the playing field is in no way level when
a character with 400+ hours of experience encounters one with 5, and
kills them. For those who say that PvP is "realistic" and therefore
better, I'd like to ask them to describe a "real" elf, or how you can
"really" cast a fireball. We are all participating in a shared
fantasy, so why not make it fun for everyone?
The main thing I find heartening is that Everquest is using a method
that has worked for years in MUDs. They considered this issue, and
it's game effect. They have more experience as a group of role-players
and MUDers than the great majority of us, and want to make a game
where everyone has a place and part to play. You can have the danger
and excitement of PvP, in addition to being able to choose to NOT
advance your level and just be a part of the tapestry that is
Norrath. I am also encouraged by their attitude towards bug
exploiters, which is concurrent with many MUDs. They do not want the
money of someone who will exploit the system and hurt it.
- Oghma, Bard, mailto:merlin@bv.net
--<cut>--
<Oghma seems to be wearing rather rosy glasses>
--
J C Lawrence Internet: claw@null.net
(Contractor) Internet: coder@ibm.net
---------(*) Internet: claw@under.engr.sgi.com
...Honourary Member of Clan McFud -- Teamer's Avenging Monolith...
- (fwd) Multiple currencies J C Lawrence
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- MUDZilla -- commercial server base J C Lawrence
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- Analysis and specification - the dirty words of mud development? Mike Sellers
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- LDAP server as ... Vadim Tkachenko
- LDAP server as ... J C Lawrence
- Nested Coordinate spaces. Elis Pomales
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- Nested Coordinate spaces. J C Lawrence
- Telepathy Rules Lawrence W. Homer
- Off topic! But please help Marian Griffith
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- META: Quoting, again. J C Lawrence
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- Databases: was skill system Adam J. Thornton
- Databases: was skill system Jon A. Lambert
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- Databases: was skill system Jon A. Lambert
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- Databases: was skill system s001gmu@nova.wright.edu
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- Databases: was skill system ##Make Nylander
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- Databases: was skill system s001gmu@nova.wright.edu
- Databases: was skill system J C Lawrence
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- Databases: was skill system T. Alexander Popiel
- Mud-time vs real-time (was skill system) Mike Sellers
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- Mud-time vs real-time (was skill system) Richard Woolcock
- Mud-time vs real-time (was skill system) Katrina McClelan
- darkness/visibility Oliver Jowett
- darkness/visibility Chris Gray
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- darkness/visibility Dr. Cat
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- darkness/visibility oliver@jowett.manawatu.planet.co.nz
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- darkness/visibility J C Lawrence
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- darkness/visibility Vadim Tkachenko
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- darkness/visibility Chris Gray
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- darkness/visibility Katrina McClelan
- darkness/visibility J C Lawrence
- darkness/visibility Chris Gray
- darkness/visibility J C Lawrence
- darkness/visibility Travis S. Casey
- darkness/visibility J C Lawrence
- darkness/visibility Travis S. Casey
- darkness/visibility J C Lawrence
- darkness/visibility Travis S. Casey
- darkness/visibility Chris Gray
- Off topic! ... J C Lawrence
- Mailing List Archives Elis Pomales
- Mailing List Archives J C Lawrence
- [Fwd: Temporality and user actions in MUDs] Richard Woolcock
- PC 99 standard In game bulletin boards vs. Web based. Mike Sellers
- PC 99 standard In game bulletin boards vs. Web based. Jo Dillon
- PC 99 standard In game bulletin boards vs. Web based. Richard Woolcock
- Away on a trip Bryce
- META: The web is a live again! J C Lawrence
- Away on a trip Bryce
- Technical C/C++ coding question Ben Greear
- Technical C/C++ coding question Katrina McClelan
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- Analysis and specification - the dirty words of mu Jon A. Lambert
- stuff that makes me leave (was In game bulletin...) Dan Shiovitz
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- stuff that makes me leave Robert Woods
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- (fwd) Temporality and user actions in MUDs J C Lawrence
- Analysis and specification Shawn Halpenny
- OT: Announcement s001gmu@nova.wright.edu
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- Analysis and specification Shawn Halpenny
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- The great crusade.... J C Lawrence
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- User Input Parser, was darkness/visibility Richard Woolcock
- what's fun? Mike Sellers
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- Mozilla: unity of interface J C Lawrence
- Mozilla: unity of interface John Bertoglio
- OT:Is worse better? Nathan F Yospe
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- [Fwd: Warfare on retromud.org 3000] Richard Woolcock
- [Fwd: Warfare on retromud.org 3000] Chris Gray
- Analysis and specification - the dirty words o Jon A. Lambert
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- ADMIN: OS Wars J C Lawrence
- MySQL scalability J C Lawrence
- Prescience Rules? [Previously submitted under wrong thread :( ] Larry Homer
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- Prescience Rules? Richard Woolcock
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- Biting the hand that feeds you J C Lawrence
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- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Marian Griffith
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Maddy
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- WIRED: Kilers have more fun s001gmu@nova.wright.edu
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Marian Griffith
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Koster, Raph
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Dr. Cat
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Mike Sellers
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- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Koster, Raph
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Marian Griffith
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Mike Sellers
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun J C Lawrence
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Mike Sellers
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun J C Lawrence
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Koster, Raph
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun J C Lawrence
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Adam Wiggins
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Damion Schubert
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Koster, Raph
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Damion Schubert
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun J C Lawrence
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun J C Lawrence
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun J C Lawrence
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Damion Schubert
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Dr. Cat
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Koster, Raph
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun S. Patrick Gallaty
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Spangler, Jason
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Joel Kelso
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Koster, Raph
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Dr. Cat
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Marian Griffith
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Jon A. Lambert
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Marian Griffith
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Holly Sommer
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Maddy
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Marian Griffith
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Dr. Cat
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Koster, Raph
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Marian Griffith
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Damion Schubert
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun J C Lawrence
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Mike Sellers
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun J C Lawrence
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Damion Schubert
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Marian Griffith
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Koster, Raph
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Damion Schubert
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Marian Griffith
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun J C Lawrence
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Damion Schubert
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun J C Lawrence
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Dr. Cat
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Jon A. Lambert
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Marian Griffith
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Jon A. Lambert
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Marian Griffith
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Matthew R. Sheahan
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Travis S. Casey
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Marian Griffith
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Travis Casey
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun J C Lawrence
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Jon A. Lambert
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Robert Woods
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Jon A. Lambert
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun s001gmu@nova.wright.edu
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Jon A. Lambert
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Jon A. Lambert
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun S. Patrick Gallaty
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Jon A. Lambert
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Matthew R. Sheahan
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun CJones@aagis.com
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Nathan F Yospe
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Jon A. Lambert
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun J C Lawrence
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Jon A. Lambert
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun J C Lawrence
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Till Eulenspiegel
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Jon A. Lambert
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun J C Lawrence
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Mike Sellers
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Nathan F Yospe
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun J C Lawrence
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Mike Sellers
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Koster, Raph
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Koster, Raph
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Dr. Cat
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Joel Kelso
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun J C Lawrence
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Matt Chatterley
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun J C Lawrence
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun J C Lawrence
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Maddy
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Koster, Raph
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Dan Shiovitz
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Koster, Raph
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Richard Woolcock
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Koster, Raph
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun J C Lawrence
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Matt Chatterley
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Damion Schubert
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Adam Wiggins
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Maddy
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Koster, Raph
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Matt Chatterley
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Matt Chatterley
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun CJones@aagis.com
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Koster, Raph
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun S. Patrick Gallaty
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Adam Wiggins
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Koster, Raph
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun S. Patrick Gallaty
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Marian Griffith
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun S. Patrick Gallaty
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Michael.Willey@abnamro.com
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun S. Patrick Gallaty
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Michael.Willey@abnamro.com
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun J C Lawrence
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Koster, Raph
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Damion Schubert
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun s001gmu@nova.wright.edu
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Michael.Willey@abnamro.com
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Damion Schubert
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Scatter
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun J C Lawrence
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun J C Lawrence
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Richard Woolcock
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun J C Lawrence
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Richard Woolcock
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Ling
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun J C Lawrence
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Matt Chatterley
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Matt Chatterley
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Damion Schubert
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun J C Lawrence
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Jon A. Lambert
- WIRED: One brave soul's UO diary. J C Lawrence
- Tron meets MUD meets the arcades. Detonation expected. J C Lawrence
- WWW/INN/news systems (Was: mud websites) Petri Virkkula
- Prescience Rules? Scatter
- Suggested theme, was WIRED: Kilers have more fun Richard Woolcock
- Suggested theme, was WIRED: Kilers have more fun Dan Shiovitz
- mud-related event: Dr. K... Brandon J. Rickman
- Suggested theme, was WIRED: Kilers have more fun Chris Gray
- Multi-Server games Ben Greear
- Multi-Server games Jo Dillon
- Multi-Server games MH
- Multi-Server games Jo Dillon
- Multi-Server games MH
- Multi-Server games J C Lawrence
- Multi-Server games Vadim Tkachenko
- Multi-Server games Ben Greear
- Multi-Server games Vadim Tkachenko
- Multi-Server games Koster, Raph
- ScryMUD: Source release, version 1.4 Ben Greear
- (fwd) Dantom's Universal Network Game (DUNG) Nathan Fenenga Yospe
- I/O Event Handling Under Linux by Richard Gooch J C Lawrence
- I/O Event Handling Under Linux by Richard Gooch s001gmu@nova.wright.edu
- Thread implementations... J C Lawrence
- Suggested theme Richard Woolcock
- Suggested theme Richard Woolcock
- Suggested theme Chris Gray
- Analysis and specification - the dirty words o J C Lawrence
- Analysis and specification - the dirty words o Jon A. Lambert
- Quotes from Marcus Ranum J C Lawrence
- Quotes from Marcus Ranum Nathan F Yospe
- Quotes from Marcus Ranum Chris Gray
- WIRED: Kilers have more fun Chris Gray
- the why of online worlds Mike Sellers
- the why of online worlds Ben Greear
- A variation on persistent store techniques with notes on distributed processing support J C Lawrence
- You think users won't number crunch and statistise your MUD? J C Lawrence
- You think users won't number crunch and statistise your MUD? Dr. Cat
- You think users won't number crunch and statistise your MUD? Ling
- You think users won't number crunch and statistise your MUD? Travis S. Casey
- You think users won't number crunch and statistise your MUD? J C Lawrence
- You think users won't number crunch and statistise your MUD? Travis S. Casey
- You think users won't number crunch and statistise your MUD? Vadim Tkachenko
- You think users won't number crunch and statistise your MUD? Chris Gray
- RP definitional structure J C Lawrence
- Combat intelligence J C Lawrence
- Combat intelligence J C Lawrence
- Combat intelligence Ling
- Combat intelligence Niklas Elmqvist
- the why of online worlds. cat
- Rules of the game: How Long Till You Die J C Lawrence
- Rules of the Game: You don't always live twice Or... Take my life, Please J C Lawrence
- roleplaying farmers? Mike L Kesl
- roleplaying farmers? J C Lawrence
- Sugarscape: A-Life variation with economic interests J C Lawrence
- Embedded languages was Databases: was skill system Chris Gray
- Embedded languages was Databases: was skill system Vadim Tkachenko