July 1997
- A simple political/social system? Jon A. Lambert
- A simple political/social system? clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- A simple political/social system? Marian Griffith
- A simple political/social system? clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- A simple political/social system? Jon A. Lambert
- Wounds and trauma Adam Wiggins
- Wounds and trauma clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Wear Location System Jon A. Lambert
- Level abstractions clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- (fwd) Popularity of text-based MUDS clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- trying again Chris Gray
- My page, such as it is. Michael A. Hohensee
- What happened? Michael Hohensee
- Testing coder@ibm.net
- > Integrating PK Matt Chatterley
- Level abstractions / Game realism issues Matt Chatterley
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Shawn Halpenny
- C&C and Event Rescheduling clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Shawn Halpenny
- C&C and Event Rescheduling clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Shawn Halpenny
- C&C and Event Rescheduling clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Shawn Halpenny
- C&C and Event Rescheduling clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Shawn Halpenny
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Chris Gray
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Shawn Halpenny
- C&C and Event Rescheduling clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Chris Gray
- C&C and Event Rescheduling clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Shawn Halpenny
- C&C and Event Rescheduling clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Jon A. Lambert
- C&C and Event Rescheduling clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Jon A. Lambert
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Jon A. Lambert
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Shawn Halpenny
- C&C and Event Rescheduling clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Nathan Yospe
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Adam Wiggins
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Richard Woolcock
- C&C and Event Rescheduling clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Richard Woolcock
- C&C and Event Rescheduling clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Adam Wiggins
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Marian Griffith
- C&C and Event Rescheduling clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Adam Wiggins
- C&C and Event Rescheduling clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Miroslav Silovic
- C&C and Event Rescheduling clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Jon A. Lambert
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Shawn Halpenny
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Miroslav Silovic
- C&C and Event Rescheduling clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Miroslav Silovic
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Miroslav Silovic
- C&C and Event Rescheduling clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Miroslav Silovic
- C&C and Event Rescheduling clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- C&C and Event Rescheduling clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Jon A. Lambert
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Shawn Halpenny
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Jeff Kesselman
- C&C and Event Rescheduling clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Jeff Kesselman
- C&C and Event Rescheduling clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- C&C and Event Rescheduling Jeff Kesselman
- not about pk anymore Marian Griffith
- not about pk anymore Huibai
- not about pk anymore Matt Chatterley
- not about pk anymore clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- not about pk anymore Alex Oren
- not about pk anymore Matt Chatterley
- not about pk anymore clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- natural language parser (Output) Nathan Yospe
- Virtual Chemistry Matt Chatterley
- Virtual Chemistry Adam Wiggins
- Virtual Chemistry Jon A. Lambert
- Virtual Chemistry Matt Chatterley
- Virtual Chemistry Jon A. Lambert
- Virtual Chemistry Adam Wiggins
- Virtual Chemistry Jon A. Lambert
- Virtual Chemistry Matt Chatterley
- Virtual Chemistry Michael Hohensee
- Virtual Chemistry Matt Chatterley
- Virtual Chemistry Marian Griffith
- Virtual Chemistry Chris Gray
- Virtual Chemistry Marian Griffith
- Virtual Chemistry Chris Gray
- Virtual Chemistry Matt Chatterley
- Virtual Chemistry Chris Gray
- Virtual Chemistry Matt Chatterley
- Virtual Chemistry clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Virtual Chemistry Matt Chatterley
- Virtual Chemistry Nathan Yospe
- Virtual Chemistry Matt Chatterley
- Virtual Chemistry Nathan Yospe
- Virtual Chemistry Matt Chatterley
- Virtual Chemistry Marian Griffith
- Virtual Chemistry Matt Chatterley
- Virtual Chemistry Marian Griffith
- Virtual Chemistry Matt Chatterley
- Virtual Chemistry Jon A. Lambert
- Virtual Chemistry Matt Chatterley
- Virtual Chemistry clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Virtual Chemistry Matt Chatterley
- Virtual Chemistry clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Virtual Chemistry Marian Griffith
- Virtual Chemistry Jon A. Lambert
- Virtual Chemistry Brandon Van Every
- Virtual Chemistry Jon A. Lambert
- Virtual Chemistry Huibai
- Virtual Chemistry Matt Chatterley
- Virtual Chemistry Matt Chatterley
- Virtual Chemistry Adam Wiggins
- Virtual Chemistry Huibai
- Virtual Chemistry Marian Griffith
- Virtual Chemistry clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Combat Adam Wiggins
- Attn JCL: A scenario for you Alex Oren
- Combat messages Marian Griffith
- Combat messages Adam Wiggins
- Combat messages Martin Keegan
- Combat messages Matt Chatterley
- What about drugs? Nathan Yospe
- What about drugs? Adam Wiggins
- What about drugs? Jon A. Lambert
- What about drugs? Martin Keegan
- coord-based recap? Huibai
- coord-based recap? clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Docs uploaded Chris Gray
- What are the elements of playabilty? clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- META: Making the list public? clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- META: Making the list public? Cynbe ru Taren
- META: Making the list public? coder@ibm.net
- META: Making the list public? Michael Hohensee
- META: Making the list public? Chris Gray
- META: Making the list public? clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- META: Making the list public? Brandon Gillespie
- META: Making the list public? clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- META: Making the list public? Michael Hohensee
- META: Making the list public? Brandon Gillespie
- META: Making the list public? Shawn Halpenny
- META: Making the list public? clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- META: Making the list public? Shawn Halpenny
- META: Making the list public? Alex Oren
- META: Making the list public? clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- META: Making the list public? Shawn Halpenny
- META: Making the list public? clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- META: Making the list public? Jon A. Lambert
- META: Making the list public? clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- META: Making the list public? Matt Chatterley
- META: Making the list public? clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- META: Making the list public? Huibai
- META: Making the list public? Martin Keegan
- META: Making the list public? clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- META: Making the list public? Marian Griffith
- META: Making the list public? Jon A. Lambert
- META: Making the list public? clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- META: Making the list public? clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- META: Making the list public? Shawn Halpenny
- META: Making the list public? clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- META: Making the list public? Matt Chatterley
- Longbows and such. Cynbe ru Taren
- R-trees &kin Cynbe ru Taren
- R-trees &kin Martin Keegan
- META: Making the list public? S001GMU@nova.wright.edu
- META: Making the list public? clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- META: C&C and Event Rescheduling clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Source data on Crossbows clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Source data on Crossbow Cynbe ru Taren
- Source data on Crossbow Matt Chatterley
- Source data on Crossbow Cynbe ru Taren
- Source data on Crossbow Matt Chatterley
- Source data on Crossbow clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Source data on Crossbow Matt Chatterley
- Source data on Crossbow clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Source data on Crossbow Matt Chatterley
- Source data on Crossbow Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- Source data on Crossbow Marian Griffith
- Source data on Crossbow clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Source data on Crossbow Orion Henry
- Source data on Crossbow Cynbe ru Taren
- Source data on Crossbow Matt Chatterley
- Source data on Crossbow Michael Hohensee
- Source data on Crossbow Matt Chatterley
- Source data on Crossbow clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Source data on Crossbow daggers@iquest.net
- Source data on Crossbow Rudy Neeser
- Source data on Crossbow Malcolm Tester II
- Source data on Crossbow Travis Casey
- Source data on Crossbow rayzam
- Source data on Crossbow Blane Bramble
- Source data on Crossbow Daniel Carruth
- Source data on Crossbow Michael Tresca
- Source data on Crossbow Bobby Martin
- Source data on Crossbow Christopher Kohnert
- Source data on Crossbow Bobby Martin
- Source data on Crossbow Christopher Kohnert
- Source data on Crossbow Dave Rickey
- Source data on Crossbow werda555@yahoo.com
- Source data on Crossbow Nathan Yospe
- Source data on Crossbow Travis Casey
- Source data on Crossbow Bobby Martin
- Source data on Crossbow Hans-Henrik Staerfeldt
- Source data on Crossbow Bobby Martin
- Source data on Crossbow Ben Tolputt
- Source data on Crossbow andy.wharton@ascentialsoftware.com
- Source data on Crossbow Skaei@aol.com
- Source data on Crossbow rayzam
- Public Archives (META: Making the list public?) Brandon Gillespie
- Socrates - A brief look at AI(?) Jon A. Lambert
- Evil coders from beyond the grave Matt Chatterley
- Evil coders from beyond the grave Orion Henry
- Evil coders from beyond the grave Matt Chatterley
- Evil coders from beyond the grave Chris Gray
- Evil coders from beyond the grave Matt Chatterley
- Evil coders from beyond the grave Adam Wiggins
- Evil coders from beyond the grave Matt Chatterley
- Graphical MUDs Michael Hohensee
- Graphical MUDs Cynbe ru Taren
- Graphical MUDs Michael Hohensee
- Graphical MUDs Shawn Halpenny
- Graphical MUDs clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Graphical MUDs Chris Gray
- Brief bio Niklas Elmqvist
- Brief bio Martin Keegan
- Multi-threaded programming under Linux Greg Munt
- Multi-threaded programming under Linux Nathan Yospe
- Multi-threaded programming under Linux Cynbe ru Taren
- Multi-threaded programming under Linux S001GMU@nova.wright.edu
- Multi-threaded programming under Linux Chris Gray
- Multi-threaded programming under Linux Jeff Kesselman
- Multi-threaded programming under Linux Cynbe ru Taren
- Multi-threaded programming under Linux Orion Henry
- Multi-threaded programming under Linux Michael Hohensee
- Multi-threaded programming under Linux] Michael Hohensee
- Multi-threaded programming under Linux clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Multi-threaded programming under Linux Jon A. Lambert
- Multi-threaded programming under Linux Nathan Yospe
- Multi-threaded programming under Linux Jon A. Lambert
- Multi-threaded programming under Linux Alex Oren
- Multi-threaded programming under Linux clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Multi-threaded programming under Linux clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- (fwd) LP: How does it work? coder@ibm.net
- Collision detection coder@ibm.net
- OT: Multi-threaded programming under Linux coder@ibm.net
- Motivating people Greg Munt
- Motivating people Chris Gray
- Motivating people Huibai
- Motivating people clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Motivating people Jon A. Lambert
- Motivating people Greg Munt
- Motivating people clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Motivating people clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- OT: Multi-threaded programming under linux Orion Henry
- Graphic MUDS. Jeff Kesselman
- Graphic MUDS. Chris Gray
- Graphic MUDS. Jeff Kesselman
- Graphic MUDS. Chris Gray
- Graphic MUDS. Matt Chatterley
- Graphic MUDS. Adam Wiggins
- Graphic MUDS. Chris Gray
- Graphic MUDS. Michael Hohensee
- Graphic MUDS. Jon A. Lambert
- Graphic MUDS. clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Graphic MUDS. Adam Wiggins
- Graphic MUDS. Martin Keegan
- Graphic MUDS. Adam Wiggins
- Graphic MUDS. clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Graphic MUDS. Martin Keegan
- Graphic MUDS. Matt Chatterley
- Graphic MUDS. Jeff Kesselman
- Graphic MUDS. clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Stories? Marian Griffith
- KaVir Nathaniel Blundell
- OT: Server Web Site Jon A. Lambert
- Recent mail delivery problems... clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Mail not getting to the list coder@ibm.net
- Mail not getting to the list Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- Mail not getting to the list Jeff Kesselman
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Koster, Raph
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Adam Wiggins
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Koster, Raph
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Jeff Kesselman
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Adam Wiggins
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Matt Chatterley
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Koster, Raph
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Jeff Kesselman
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Matt Chatterley
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Adam Wiggins
> On Tue, 12 Aug 1997 clawrenc@cup.hp.com wrote:
> > at 07:36 PM, Jeff Kesselman <jeffk@tenetwork.com> said:
> > >How do you prevent or control the cheapening of such info resources??
> >
> > There are several parts to this problem:
>
> Its certainly not easy.
Well, sharing information is a *good* think - your world just needs to
be complex enough that knowledge of how one player plays the game
doesn't 'spoil' it for you and your own character.
> > Exact solutions -- To get by the Demon Wroth do X, Y and Z as
> > follows and yada yada. I consider these signs of greviously poor game
> > design. That's the sort of bumph I expect in single player Infocom
> > games, its not suited at all to MP games.
>
> This dog has had its day, and its time for it to be put down - exact
> solutions are easily recordable and communicatable, making them valueless.
Not only that there shouldn't be exact answers written down somewhere,
but there is no such thing as an exact answer (see JC's example). There's
just some sort of obstacle, and you overcome it the best you can given
the capabilities of your own character. This is part of what makes
it a CRPG and not an adventure game.
> > Character solutions -- To get by the Demon Wroth you're going to
> > have to either scare it away from the drawbridge, or lure it away. So
> > far the DW seems to be attracted to curvaceous virgins in too-small
> > bikinis from the local villages, and somewhat scared of Cerebus. I've
> > managed to get by him twice with the bimbos (got killed three more
> > times trying that same trick tho), and just got past him again getting
> > Cerbus to chase me and then running straight at DW. Of Cerebus keeps
> > catching me just the other side of the drawbridge which is another
> > problem.
>
> This is of course far, far better - the information you can give another
> player consists of what happened to you, not what you know will happen to
> them. Better still are quests (if we consider this a quest) that cease to
> exist, or change dynamically with time and completion (for instance
> "Retrieve X object" might entail retrieving it from the last person to
> finish the quest!).
Sure. We figure that if we do any quests at all, they will be things
like 'bring me the Amulet of WuggWugg!' Given that the amulet is
a one-of-a-kind artifact that is extremely useful to mages (they can
store mana in it or something), and that all objects have complete
permenancy, this 'quest' could involve looting a dragon's hoarde,
killing the owner, buying it from someone, or pulling it out of your
pocket and saying, 'Say! Lucky I had this!'
> > In an MP environment rote solutions to problems, puzzles are a flim
> > flam game. They're not worth the effort to code. Its somewhat like
> > relying on a a maze to make getting somehwere difficult and assuming
> > that no player will map the maze and then pass on his maps.
>
> But with a maze, you can generate it randomly (with an engine), so it is
> only mappable for one time period (completion).
Mazes are boring enough without random generation to make them
completely tedious and pointless.
> > insight (more kudos to them!), or after significant investigation and
> > play, which process would have already immersed them in the world and
> > given them a stake. Newbie players would have no idea -- there is no
> > evidence the streetsweeper is anything but a harmless old fool.
>
> Yup - I don't know how to cover this up, though, or rather stop it being
> passed around, unless the information bestowed some advantages on the
> player that they did not wish to share.
Bingo. One mud I played had a certain ring which was by far the
best one for any warrior-type. Naturally, there was a large demand
for them, as this mud was running 100+ players online 24 hours a day
(probably at least half of which were warrior-types) and the rings
only 'popped' once every 24 hours. It also didn't hurt that every
warrior wanted two of them, and if you died any 'mean' NPC would
instantly loot them from your corpse and eat them.
The rings weren't hard to get, they were just in a hidden location.
It was one of the many 'big secrets' on the mud - a few select top
players knew where to get them, and everyone else was forced to buy
them at incredibly exhorbent prices (~10 million gold on a mud where
good items sold for around 100k.) As far as I know this secret
was never breached, along with other similar ones there. I figured out
how to get the rings after someone gave me a very specific hint and I spent
approxametely three hours trying to figure it out.
The fact that this could work so well for the ~3 years the mud was
on-line makes me believe that it's not impossible to keep select things secret.
Of course, the main downside to this is that most people knew *about* the
rings, just not the specific info on where to get them. By the same token
you could do things like spells whose power level is inversely proportional
to either the total number of times they've ever been cast, or the number
of people in the world that 'know' them. Thus if someone learns a spell, they
aren't going to be too inclined to share it, or share the info on how to get
it. Or poisons - if no one knows how you made that poison or where the
components came from, it's more likely that your victims will be unable to
get the antidote. Or vice versa - you may not want to share your knowledge
of dangerous herbs with others for fear they will use them as weapons.
As for the janitor example above, that's a little trickier. There has
to be a pretty good reason for not revealing the secret to just anyone.
The most obvious reason, of course, is that your character fears for their
safety by sharing such knowledge. This doesn't work, however, when it's
just up on a user website somewhere. I can't think of any direct
solutions right off hand, but one thing I *love* doing is giving false
information. Ie, if you constantly hear NPCs gossiping about so-and-so
being a secret underground resistance leader or morphing into a dragon
at night, you're going to be less inclined to believe it when someone
says 'that old fool is actually a mafia boss.' You'd only believe it,
perhaps, when you actually saw the underground opperation going on, and
presumably then some other reason would exist for you not sharing. - Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Alex Oren
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Adam Wiggins
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Matt Chatterley
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Koster, Raph
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Chris Gray
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Richard Woolcock
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Matt Chatterley
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Matt Chatterley
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Matt Chatterley
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Chris Gray
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Jeff Kesselman
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Nathan Yospe
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Matt Chatterley
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Matt Chatterley
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Richard Woolcock
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Matt Chatterley
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Jeff Kesselman
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Matt Chatterley
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Richard Woolcock
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Nathan Yospe
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Richard Woolcock
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Nathan Yospe
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Adam Wiggins
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Matt Chatterley
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Koster, Raph
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Jeff Kesselman
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Michael Hohensee
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Adam Wiggins
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Matt Chatterley
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Matt Chatterley
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Jeff Kesselman
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Adam Wiggins
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Jeff Kesselman
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Adam Wiggins
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online Jeff Kesselman
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Graphic MUDS/Ultima Online clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- First Muds - newbie magic? Nathan Yospe
- First Muds - newbie magic? clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- First Muds - newbie magic? Martin Keegan
- Dynamic Descriptions Nathan Yospe
- Dynamic Descriptions Chris Gray
- Dynamic Descriptions Martin Keegan
- Dynamic Descriptions clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Dynamic Descriptions Nathan Yospe
- Dynamic Descriptions Jeff Kesselman
- Dynamic Descriptions clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Dynamic Descriptions Jeff Kesselman
- Persistant worlds, Dan Huibai
- Worlds VS Games, etc {was GMuds, UO} Nathan Yospe
- Worlds VS Games, etc {was GMuds, UO} Koster, Raph
- OT: NIS/AlterNIC and the DNS system Caliban Tiresias Darklock
- OT: Mail not getting to the list clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- OT: Mail not getting to the list clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Persistance/stability Chris Gray
- Persistance/stability Miroslav Silovic
- Persistance/stability Matt Chatterley
- Persistance/stability clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- Persistance/stability Chris Gray
- Persistance/stability Brandon Gillespie
- Persistance/stability Adam Wiggins
- Persistance/stability Chris Gray
- Persistance/stability Adam Wiggins
- Tilting at the SimWindmill - was UO Jon A. Lambert
- DESIGN: The purpose of MUDding? coder@ibm.net
- DESIGN: The purpose of MUDding? Brandon Van Every
- DESIGN: The purpose of MUDding? Matt Chatterley
- DESIGN: The purpose of MUDding? Brandon Van Every
- DESIGN: The purpose of MUDding? Matt Chatterley
- DESIGN: The purpose of MUDding? clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- DESIGN: The purpose of MUDding? Matt Chatterley
- DESIGN: The purpose of MUDding? Jeff Kesselman
- DESIGN: The purpose of MUDding? Jeff Kesselman
- DESIGN: The purpose of MUDding? clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- DESIGN: The purpose of MUDding? clawrenc@cup.hp.com
- DESIGN: The purpose of MUDding? clawrenc@cup.hp.com